Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 41

Thread: Government Grants or Loans

  1. #21
    Post Impressionist
    Array
    vangogh's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Boulder, Colorado
    Posts
    15,061
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    You're probably right. Plus we each don't contribute quite as much to any candidate's campaign individually.
    l Join me as I share my creative process and journey as a writer | StevenBradley.me
    l Design, Development, Marketing, and SEO Tutorials | Steven Bradley's Notebook
    l Get my book about Design Fundamentals

  2. #22
    Registered User
    Array
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    DC Metro Area
    Posts
    137

    Default

    Actually, many local (not federal) governments have programs to help start ups... In the area I live, the county government has set up business incubators which allow start up companies to have office space /lab space for free or cheap to get off the ground. The local governments are the most interested in helping local business because it improves the local tax base.... The fed doesn't, and in my opinion shouldn't care about small business... this is a state and local matter and should be handled by the local governments.
    The Ad-Vice Man - Expert Advertising Advice
    www.harborpilotmedia.com,
    www.freeadvertisingadvice.org

  3. #23
    Moderator
    Array
    Dan Furman's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Kingston, NY
    Posts
    1,258

    Default

    See, here's my problem with programs/funding as we're discussing them: it's fine to say that government should help small business, because that's who creates jobs, etc etc.

    But, in my opinion, the biggest roadblock to most small businesses is what Paris touched on - living expenses. I mean, let's be honest here: in general terms, when small business financing (etc) is discussed in places like this, it's not about buying a building, buying a fleet of cars, buying a franchise, etc etc. It's about paying the bills while they work on the business. It's about buying a computer, etc. Small stuff.

    It might be a little hard-hearted of me, but I do not think funding should be used for that on the small scale that we are talking about. If you want to start, say, a local B2B IT services business (one where you need to quit your job so you are available business hours), your living expenses should come from savings and credit. And if those two are not available, it would be fair to at least question your business acumen in the first place. Not saying it would be bad, but if you don't have any credit in "life", how can you expect to run a business?

    I can also understand if someone who has the credit and savings doesn't want to do that, either, especially if they have a family. But then, in my mind, business should probably remain a dream for them.

    Again, hard-hearted, but perfectly reasonable (imho.)
    Dan Furman - Copywriter, Business Author, Entrepreneurial/Business Consultant
    Business Writing Services | Website Copywriting Services | Blog here

  4. #24
    Queen of the Forum
    Array
    KristineS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Traverse City, MI
    Posts
    4,734
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    I don't necessarily think you're being hard hearted Dan, just realistic.

    You're right, for some people owning their own business might be an unacceptable risk. There's nothing wrong with that, as long as you are able to analyze the costs and benefits and make an informed decision. Ultimately the success or failure of your business rests on you, so the responsibility for keeping yourself afloat should rest on you too.

  5. #25
    Post Impressionist
    Array
    vangogh's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Boulder, Colorado
    Posts
    15,061
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    Dan I don't think you're being hard either. I agree for many small businesses it's the living expenses too.

    I guess what I mean is I'd prefer to see some tax breaks favor small business instead of large corporations. I'm not sure what would be the right tax, but the system at the moment seems like it overly favors larger companies.

    I also know there are loans available through organizations like SBA, but they're still just loans given out by banks and they generally work the same way most business loans work. You get it once you prove you don't need it. Maybe the requirements for loans could be relaxed a little. Not to the point where anyone who wants one gets one, but maybe it's less about the collateral and more about something you can show with your business plan.

    Seems like there should be something to help those people you know have what it takes to make it to get started.

    Again I'm not advocating just giving money to small businesses. I think if that happened you'd find a lot of people leaving jobs and calling themselves small businesses. But there are people who might not have the money to start (even if that money is for living expenses) that you can tell are going to get somewhere. Just think about people who pop into forums talking about starting a new business. Without mentioning names there are some you can tell are ready to be in business for themselves and others who you can pretty much tell will be looking for a job again in a month or two.
    l Join me as I share my creative process and journey as a writer | StevenBradley.me
    l Design, Development, Marketing, and SEO Tutorials | Steven Bradley's Notebook
    l Get my book about Design Fundamentals

  6. #26
    Refugee from the .com
    Array
    cbscreative's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Right here
    Posts
    2,915

    Default

    I don't consider that hard hearted either, Dan. I say this as someone who grew up basiclly poor, and never had things handed to me. At the time, I resented how easy it seemed for some. While my peers were getting things like cars for a graduation gift, I had to work the entire summer to save money to buy my first car. The job sucked, and the car was 10 years old. Back then, 10 year old cars were pretty much toast.

    My perspective now is different. While I would have liked to have had someone making things easier for me, I now see the value of having to earn it myself. Our culture seems to value sugar daddies to the point where many people have no idea what struggle really is.

    There are many perspectives on what went wrong in the 1960's. Here's one I believe to be true. The parents of the 60's generation were a product of the Depression and WWII. These people knew difficulty and pain and hell. They understandably did not want their children to ever have to endure that. The result was that they put so much effort into protecting their children that many of them had nothing better to do than smoke pot and rebel against the system.

    Now I may be the one sounding harsh, but there is no substitute for fighting your way to the top and being self made. The idea of getting help may be popular, but it often shelters people from personal responsibility. I'm not against a "hand up" but I think that "handouts" do more harm than good.
    Steve Chittenden

    Web design, graphic design, professional writing, and marketing.

    "Far better is it to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat." -- Theodore Roosevelt

  7. #27
    Moderator
    Array
    Dan Furman's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Kingston, NY
    Posts
    1,258

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by vangogh View Post
    Dan I don't think you're being hard either. I agree for many small businesses it's the living expenses too.

    I guess what I mean is I'd prefer to see some tax breaks favor small business instead of large corporations. I'm not sure what would be the right tax, but the system at the moment seems like it overly favors larger companies.
    That's not quite true - I've done a ton of writing this year about section 179, and it's a major tax break aimed at small and medium sized businesses (and phases out for large ones). In a nutshell, it allows you to deduct the full purchase price of equipment in the current tax year. It's not new (it's known as "the hummer tax break"), but the limits were greatly expanded this year with the Economic Stimulus Act of 2008.

    Section 179 Tax Deductions for 2008 and 2007 | Section179.org
    Dan Furman - Copywriter, Business Author, Entrepreneurial/Business Consultant
    Business Writing Services | Website Copywriting Services | Blog here

  8. #28
    Post Impressionist
    Array
    vangogh's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Boulder, Colorado
    Posts
    15,061
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    It could be more me looking at this as it related to my business than anything else. I'm certainly not an expert on taxes at all.

    A tax on the purchase price of equipment is great, but for someone like me it's often better in theory than practice, because my equipment needs are minimal. Again that's me and not all small businesses. Obviously some would make greater use of section 179 than I would. And it's not to say I can't make use of it either. I'm always happy to purchase a tax deductible computer.

    Thank you for pointing out the tax deduction by the way.

    I do know there are tax breaks and incentives and again I'm probably looking at this more from my own experience and perspective. In my current business I wasn't looking for any help in the way of finances. I've been happy to finance everything myself even if that meant some months with a lot of struggle early on.

    Prior to this business I tried starting a similar business with a friend. Admittedly in the beginning what we needed most was living expense money. A few things to invest in like better computers and software would have been nice, but mostly what we needed was to cover personal expenses and marketing. Maybe we just didn't find it, but there didn't seem to be much to help us get going.

    Now I can understanding tax payers not wanting to pay our bills for a few months. I wouldn't have expected or wanted anyone to hand us money. I remember talking to a bank in regards to an SBA loan and we were basically told to there was no chance of us getting a loan. We were hardly looking for a lot either.

    Now maybe we wouldn't have been good a risk under any circumstances at that time. I'm not at all suggesting we should have gotten a loan simply because we asked for one. But I could see how there might have been programs that would have helped us put together a realistic plan for starting our business, made us more aware of some things we'd need to do, etc. Maybe assuming we could show that we had absorbed all that was taught to us it could have tipped the scales a little in favor of a loan.

    What I remember was going into SBA and while in theory they help you with some of the above info it was really just a few quick and mostly meaningless handouts that didn't help us much at all. Could have been the SBA office we happened to go to and not all.

    We were two people with very little understanding of what business was really about, but we were both people very willing to learn and work hard. Since then I have managed to teach myself most of what I would have liked to know then and I didn't need a loan or financial assistance (which maybe argues your point better than mine), but I can see how a little more help than we received early on could have helped to put us on a better track for success.

    Again I'm not at all advocating our government just hand out money to people. I've come across plenty of people who would simply take the money and do nothing with it, but my sense is that more could be done to help people get started.

    Maybe it's not really money that they need, but rather better education about some things. I'm not really sure. My own experience gave me the sense that there wasn't really much out there, which may have just been my admittedly limited experience with this.

    Everyone's seen the stats about X% of businesses failing in the first year and another Y% failing the in the first 5 years. I realize a lot of that is people starting businesses they weren't really committed to or people with very little understand of how to start a business, and even just simply some rather bad business ideas. I can't help but think the numbers also include some hard working people who do understand business and have good ideas and business models, but couldn't weather some early storms. If there were more help for this group of people...
    l Join me as I share my creative process and journey as a writer | StevenBradley.me
    l Design, Development, Marketing, and SEO Tutorials | Steven Bradley's Notebook
    l Get my book about Design Fundamentals

  9. #29
    Moderator
    Array
    Dan Furman's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Kingston, NY
    Posts
    1,258

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by vangogh View Post
    Everyone's seen the stats about X% of businesses failing in the first year and another Y% failing the in the first 5 years. I realize a lot of that is people starting businesses they weren't really committed to or people with very little understand of how to start a business, and even just simply some rather bad business ideas. I can't help but think the numbers also include some hard working people who do understand business and have good ideas and business models, but couldn't weather some early storms. If there were more help for this group of people...
    Yea, I understand exactly what you are saying. And I agree in theory, but the problem is finding these people. It's all but impossible (by the way, I also agree with you on the SBA - next to useless for a small kitchen table startup looking for 5-10k.)
    Dan Furman - Copywriter, Business Author, Entrepreneurial/Business Consultant
    Business Writing Services | Website Copywriting Services | Blog here

  10. #30
    Registered User
    Array
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    DC Metro Area
    Posts
    137

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Furman View Post
    Yea, I understand exactly what you are saying. And I agree in theory, but the problem is finding these people. It's all but impossible (by the way, I also agree with you on the SBA - next to useless for a small kitchen table startup looking for 5-10k.)
    To clarify a few points about SBA programs that were a little errouneous.

    To get a 7A Program SBA loan (business acquisition or start up and operating expenses) you don't need any collateral at all... However, if you have collateral, you have to use it. They want to make sure (as Dan Pointed out) that you're committed to business. The most important things to the SBA to get one of these loans are A) A SOLID business plan and B) Proprietor Expertise in the field of the business.

    You're right these loans are more geared for $50k or more Which could in theory encompasse the owners salaray, thus funding living expenses while getting the company off the ground.

    However, there are a number of Micro Loan programs out there. Again the county in which I live administers a small Business micro loan program fro loan under $50,000 again the interest rates aren't fantastic... but their still much better than credit cards.
    The Ad-Vice Man - Expert Advertising Advice
    www.harborpilotmedia.com,
    www.freeadvertisingadvice.org

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •