PDA

View Full Version : New website/SEO question



BillR
01-26-2009, 01:06 PM
I've routinely heard that new websites can take 6-12 months to show up in search engines and that if you are trying to get a website up and running before that you may consider buying a domain name because the older a domain name is the more it is "trusted" by the search engines.

Yes, I know a lot of other factors play into the SEO rating of course...but here's my question:

Let's say I have a domain name that I have had for years - 3 years I believe - that has just been parked. There has been no hosting, no content, nothing, period. For all intents and purposes it is brand new except that it was registered 3+ years ago.

Where would this rate for age? New? or 3 years old?

vangogh
01-26-2009, 01:40 PM
I'm not sure there's an answer for you. I don't think you can say according to Google the site is considered to be X years old. Here's some of what I believe to be true about how Google looks at domains though.

If you were to transfer a domain from one person to another Google can tell there's a new registrant. In your case ownership isn't changing hands.

If a site is about dog biscuits one day and auto parts the next, Google can tell and would likely consider the domain to be new. Again this isn't really the case with your site.

The idea with a sandbox or aging is less to do with a length of time and more to do with trust. How long a site has been online can be a signal of trust, which is where age comes in. It's not true that new websites take 6-12 months to show up in search engines. Brand new sites can rank for things the moment the pages are indexed. As long as Google can find the page it can index the page.

New sites have a harder time ranking for competitive phrases because the competition is ahead of things having spent time being online, acquiring links, building signals of trust.

Some people think buying an old domain helps you rank faster. I think it depends on what used to be on the domain and what's currently on the domain. If the site is now about something completely different than it used to be, there's little to no benefit. Maybe some of the links the original site gathered can still pass some weight, but most will probably be seen as completely unrelated to the site. The situation might be the same as if you launched a new site and build in a lot of low quality links to start. That can actually hurt you more than help you as it leads to a very low signal to noise ratio.

On the other hand if the old and new sites are related in subject it can probably help. In that case it might simply be seen as someone new coming in at the top. If you bought a site about auto parts for the domain and put up a brand new site about auto parts then it probably helps. Your links would still be relevant and likely have useful anchor text. The site would still be sending out most of the same trust signals as well.

But there's no reason to buy an old domain just because it's old. Keep in mind that you could also inherit all the problems the old site faced.

So should you use your 3 year old parked domain? It might be a little better than registering a brand new domain, but in truth probably not a lot. I see no reason why you shouldn't use that domain, but I wouldn't expect it to have a major impact on anything. Your new site is still not going to be able to rank for competitive phrases right away simply because the competition is ahead of you.

cbscreative
01-26-2009, 01:48 PM
I would second the opinion that using the domain you've had parked should have the benefit of being 3 years old even though you have not actually used it yet. I think vangogh did a good job of describing the variables in "aging" a site. In less competitive markets, especially when you are trying to get "local" results, new domains can rank very quickly (within a month or two rather than 6 or more).

nealrm
01-26-2009, 02:34 PM
A site that has been parked for 3 years is basicly a new site. In general, Google looks at the age of the links pointing to a site. In your case, the average age of the links pointing to your site is zero.

But, go ahead of use the site if the URL matches what you are planning to do. If the URL is not a good match, buy a different URL.

vangogh
01-26-2009, 03:32 PM
Google looks at the age of the links pointing to a site.

Good point. I agree too about using the parked domain. Assuming the name fits the topic of the new site I'd think it fine to use. Maybe being online could send an aging signal, but even if it does it would be a small one at best. You're right that it's more the age of the links and the sites those links are coming from that's more important.

Bill, in the end just pick a domain that fits with the site. That'll weight more than trying to have your domain be aged.

Business Attorney
01-26-2009, 04:46 PM
I have read that the age of the site is one of the 200 or so factors in Google's algorithm but I agree with vangogh's analysis that the real question turns on much more than the simple age.

And BillR, I assume when you say "new websites can take 6-12 months to show up in search engines" you mean it can take 6-12 months to rank well. I have found that my new websites get into the index within a few days, or even a few hours, after the spider finds my site. Of course, simply being in the index doesn't mean much if you the 978th result on a search for your keyword.

cbscreative
01-26-2009, 05:29 PM
Good point to bring up, David, there is a bg difference between indexing and ranking. Google and other search engines find and index a site rather quickly, especially the Home page, but ranking can take a while.

seolman
01-26-2009, 11:42 PM
All good points made here - right on the money. One last item to go along with David's point about being indexed quickly: for low competition keywords you can actually get decent rankings within a couple months, we do quite frequently so keyword rich content up quickly is key.

BillR
01-27-2009, 03:17 PM
Thanks for all the input.

I specfically bought these domains for their use - they are very well named and URL specific to their intent. I own a bunch of different domain names all of which are future pet projects of mine.

My favorite is one I've owned since 1999 - doryphoros.com - I'm saving that one for the future.

The others I'll keep quiet for now - I'll post them once I get a site up. They are decidedly un-spectacular but simple and easy to remember.

*edit: Okay, who put code in to automatically change my URL to a clickable URL?

vangogh
01-27-2009, 06:04 PM
Okay, who put code in to automatically change my URL to a clickable URL?

That's just default behavior of vBulletin. Looks like you figured out how to counteract it.

orion_joel
01-27-2009, 08:30 PM
I have managed to take a site from no listing in google, not even when you search site:www.domain.com, to having pages listed in a matter of 2 days. All that you need to do is submit it to google, through there website. here http://www.google.com/addurl/?continue=/addurl and then look to get some people linking to the site. The one that i mentioned was a business site which i commented and linked on my blog, (yes was a relevent post to) and within 48 hours the site was being indexed by google and the site:www.domain.com search was showing results.

vangogh
01-27-2009, 08:56 PM
Joel you don't really need to submit your site to Google. In fact I'd be willing to bet your submission had nothing to do with getting the site indexed. Submitting doesn't hurt you, but it's a mostly pointless pursuit. Your submission puts your site on a list for Google to crawl. However there's no guarantee Google will crawl the sites on that list. Most are usually spam so there's not much incentive for them to crawl the list.

The best way to get your site indexed is simply to have a web page that's in the index link to yours. A link in your forum signature will do the trick. Forums get crawled fairly often since the content changes frequently.

Another way to get indexed quickly is to run your site on something like WordPress that sends out pings. Odds are one of those pings finds it's way to Google, which alerts them of your site.

Outside of the first site I ever built I've never submitted to Google and it's never taken more than a day or two for the sites since to start getting crawled and indexed.

cbscreative
01-27-2009, 11:49 PM
Vangogh's advice is very similar to what I read on Google years ago. By their own admission, they say that manually submitting will neither hurt you nor speed up the process of getting indexed. By the time they get to your "place in the stack" they will have most likely already indexed you through their automated processes. I don't submit sites either, and they still get indexed quickly.

phanio
01-28-2009, 06:48 AM
Keeping with the aging comments, my hosting company told me that Google likes to see how a long a domain is registered into the future. My first thought was that they were just trying to get me buy the domain for a longer period. Is this true or were they just trying to up sell me?

nealrm
01-28-2009, 07:21 AM
That sounds like an up sale to me.

As far as getting a site indexed, Vangogh is correct. A link from an indexed site to yours will do the trick. I suggest you place a link in your signature of the forums you visit. A few posts will easily do the trick.

Also, don't forget to create and submit a sitemap. It by itself will not get your site index any faster. But when your site is indexed, Google will do a more through job.

nealrm
01-28-2009, 07:22 AM
One more thing, when you do the links be sure to use your keywords, not your site URL.

Business Attorney
01-28-2009, 09:44 AM
Keeping with the aging comments, my hosting company told me that Google likes to see how a long a domain is registered into the future. My first thought was that they were just trying to get me buy the domain for a longer period. Is this true or were they just trying to up sell me?
I can't say whether it is true or not but I have read it many times in webmaster forums, so it seems to be a commonly held belief. The argument makes sense - that someone who is in his domain for the long haul is more likely to put up a quality site.

However, even if the length of the period for which you purchase the domain is one of the 200 or so factors in the Google algorithm, I think it has to have very little weight. While it may be a weak indicator of intent to create a good site, the fact that someone buys a domain for 10 years does not mean that the site is better than one whose owner renews the name every year. The whole purpose of including factors in the algorithm is to deliver the most useful searches, and this factor would seem to contribute only marginally to that goal.

vangogh
01-28-2009, 11:37 AM
The idea of longer registration being better comes from a couple of things. A few years ago Google became a domain registrar. They don't offer registration, but they can see the records. Second is the thought that someone who'd planning on spamming expects their domain to get banned and will only register the domain for the minimum amount of time. So if spammers are only registering for one year than anyone who registers for more than one year must be legit.

I'm not suggesting any of the above is true. But that's the basic thinking behind longer registration being good for SEO.

It makes sense that Google could use registration time as a trust signal. But knowing that it's easy enough for spammers to register for two years. If you look hard enough and time things right you can find domains for $2 a year. Hardly much of an expense even if you expect to burn through a domain quickly.

So while it makes sense to a degree to look at registration time as a trust signal you can't really place too much emphasis on it. More than likely this is one of those things someone threw out there as a theory and since it makes sense on the surface it became common knowledge. Odds are it doesn't play much or any role.

When it comes time to decide how long to register your domain, make the decision based on other things. Don't worry about the seo implications. If you plan on being in business with a domain for awhile go ahead and register it for a few years. If you're not sure about the domain, register it for a year. Either way don't put too much weight on how it's going to impact your search results. Truth is it won't.