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View Full Version : The Cable Industry is the biggest rip off of the century



Harold Mansfield
06-07-2012, 10:44 AM
I'm so angered by the whole cable TV industry that I can barely think about it. I hate paying my bill because I'm sure that I'm getting screwed, and the fact that there isn't any competition for fast internet speeds is even more angering.

And then the con job of paying per service, when it all comes from the same line, same hook up, and from the same source is ridiculous.

1. Paying for commercial television: It's the biggest con job ever. To think that it has been legislated that the only choice you have is a crappy conversion box with questionable quality or paying for cable is ridiculous. If you had told me years ago that I'd be paying $80 a month to be advertised to, I would have laughed at you. When this whole thing started, the premise was that you were paying for non commercial television and specialty programming. HBO, Showtime, etc. Now they have slowly conned us into paying for local stations, and high definition commercials. It's a total rip off.

2. High Speed Internet: The whole idea of rationing out the speed, and pricing it based on levels is a total con job. They are actually limiting the natural speed of the connection to squeeze more money of the line. Just provide the service as best you can and set one price. Whywould you spend money on extra hardware to only get $40 a month out of a connection, when you can just let it run naturally and get $50 a month from everyone?

The choices of A. "Do you want a connection?". B. "Do you want it to work?", and C. "Do you want it fast enough to actually do anything?", is infuriating. My cable provider offers 10mbps for $40. 20mbps for $50, and then 50mbps for $120. Nothing in between and even though I like and need the 50mbps, it's extremely overpriced. And they know it. And they know I know it.

3. Phone: $10 extra a month for a voip line sounds like a good deal, until you realize that they are charging for long distance calls like it's 1999. Who, in the age of Vonage, Magic Jack, and unlimited mobile plans can justify still charging for long distance by the minute? Cable companies. That's who.

Of course I pay my bill every month. But out of all of the things I pay for, my cable bill is the one that makes me angry. The cost for the value is not there. I feel like I'm being taken advantage of and they are totally price gouging based on the fact that they have no competition.

Am I the only one that feels totally ripped off by the industry?

KristineS
06-07-2012, 12:47 PM
Nope, you're not alone.

I bought a bundle package, phone/internet/TV when I hooked up at my condo because they offered cheap rates for new customers. My bill has steadily risen since then. I dumped the land line about a year ago, thinking that would reduce the bill some and it's now pretty much right back where it was while I still had the phone. I'm seriously contemplating dumping the television and investigating Roku or something along that line. Internet is where I'm kind of stuck.

Their service is terribly expensive and not that great. It also frosts me that I'll see advertisements aimed at people who aren't currently customers offering the same services I'm paying top dollar for at a much reduced rate. That really makes me angry.

billbenson
06-07-2012, 01:38 PM
It sounds like you have a lousy cable company. Consider a couple of things though. For 10 years or more, cable companies have been putting fiber optic cable in the ground locally and running cable around homes and buildings. Still mostly fiber to neighborhoods, but some fiber to the curb and experiments with fiber to the home. Coming from the Telecom industry, running all that fiber (called outside plant) is absolutely the most expensive part.

" $40. 20mbps for $50, and then 50mbps for $120": You don't need the faster speeds. Internet isn't that fast. Sure, do a speed test and it may say you have 30M download for some image. To do a real test download a big file and look at your download speed. software.opensuse.org: Download openSUSE 12.1 (http://software.opensuse.org/121/en) is a 4.7G download for a Linux distribution that you could use. You will find that the download speed is way below the 5M. It doesn't do you any good to get 50M download if the network will only give you 2 or 3. It's marketing hype. I get 800k to 1.2 M upload which is enough for VoIP which is what matters unless you are FTP ing a big site or something.

I don't pay for long distance. Again, sounds like you have a lousy provider.

You are correct though, they are going the way of the cell companies and airlines by nickle and diming you which is a real pain in the butt.

Actually, I have an incredibly good ISP. No contract (and the competitive company has a 1 year contract). If I want to move the location of a tv, they will usually move the cable for free. Dropped a cable box and they replaced it for free. Stuck a shovel through the cable in my back yard. They fixed it for free. I think I pay more than you do, don't remember, but you couldn't get me to switch.

Harold Mansfield
06-07-2012, 01:43 PM
I do get the speed, I check it often. And I am FTP'ing websites of various sizes all day long.
I would rather have something in the 30 range, but they don't offer it. It's 20, or 50 at double the price.

I also know that the Federal Government subsidized much of that Fiber Optic work.

cbscreative
06-07-2012, 02:11 PM
I probably would be with you, in fact, I know I would. The reason I'm so sure is that I parted ways with cable long ago. For a number of years, we had satellite but found that the amount of use was nowhere near enough to justify the price and dropped that at least 3 years ago. Until more people get angry enough to take the same action, the gouging will continue.

Yeah, the idea of paying to be advertised to is the one I found completely unacceptable. A subscription should be devoid of ads. Get your money through ads or subscriptions. Doing both is deplorable! If you want to start a rebellion to stop this practice, count me in.

The solution I settled on has some sacrifices, but I found the benefits outweigh the costs. I have everything through Internet. We use DSL which has speeds close to cable regardless of the claims cable companies spew out. Advertised speeds for DSL tend to be about what they advertise. Advertised speeds for cable focus on the words "up to" which means in the perfect world none of us live in.

If I understand my tech training correctly, DSL is more of a dedicated line giving you a fairly consistent speed. Cable is shared and speeds are influenced by traffic and the number of customers hooked to the same relay. My DSL may be slightly slower than the average cable customer, but my experience on cable connections hasn't been that impressive. I currently pay $35 for the fastest DSL connection.

The other sacrifice is live TV, but our viewing habits had us watching very little of that anyway. If you're patient enough to wait 24-48 hours, you can watch your shows on Hulu. We're among the few who still use Netflix. They have a good selection of "old" TV shows, but the movie selection is about as bad as you hear about. The available movies are decent, but not great. The main reason we keep it is the streaming library is useful and not too expensive.

If Hulu and Netflix aren't enough, check out the selection on Amazon. Usually for 2-4 dollars, you can rent and download just about anything you need.

That may not be as convenient as cable, but it's worth it to tell them what they can do with their overpriced dictatorship.

KristineS
06-07-2012, 03:48 PM
Speaking of Amazon as a television option, join Prime for $79 a year and you get free 2 day shipping of anything you order and access to tons of free content, television at least, on Amazon Video on Demand. I watch a lot of my television through that service now. I can either watch things for free, or buy an episode for $1.99 or some entire seasons for $15 or $20. That's still much cheaper than cable.

Harold Mansfield
06-07-2012, 07:47 PM
I do have a netflix account. Streaming only for $8.99, which is fine. But you are right , the movie selection is really crappy.
Still can't figure out how to get Hulu on the TV. Anything that I try and access it with, that isn't my desktop, it redirects me to Hulu Plus and wants me to pay based on what device I'm using. Screw that. That's a rip off too.

I'm going to do something drastic. And soon. My bill is $207 a month. No HBO. No Movie Channels. It's Digital, but not HD. I have a bunch of commercial stations and 17 of them aren't even in English.
And if I make a long distance call on the phone it's still 0.05 cents a minute. That's some bull.

GalFriday
06-07-2012, 09:51 PM
It's always irked me that we've been charged for commercials. I do remember when cable tv was all entertainment and no commercial.

I have Comcast, and I don't like them. They're always playing some kind of pricing game. Last summer I went to their service center to get a new remote and of course the guy asks if I want to add a package or phone. I say, sure - if it's cheaper than what I'm paying now. So he gave me a cheaper package, and then said the price would go back up in January, but that it would still be cheaper than what I'm paying now. Okay - fine.

So a couple of months ago I'm yet again getting a new remote and the guy tells me that my rates are going up AGAIN in July. Huh? Why? What are you giving me that you're raising my rates again? Nothing. I have to drop them - at least for TV. I've got Amazon Prime (LOVE IT - so worth the money), and Netflix streaming.

I'm thinking of Roku. Has anyone used it?

huggytree
06-08-2012, 07:46 AM
i pay for the bundle also....i paid $99 for a few years and now pay $180

i want to dump it and purchase each separately from someone else, but cant because they are the only high speed internet option

plus satellite tv loses reception every time it rains

KristineS
06-08-2012, 12:00 PM
I'm thinking of Roku. Has anyone used it?

I'm considering Roku too. I have a friend who has it, and he says it's great and he gets lots of channels. It also works with Hulu Plus and Amazon Instant Video, which is where I'm watching most of my television these days anyway. The more I read about it, the more sense it makes. Plus, it's cheaper than the cable I'm paying for and almost never watch.

billbenson
06-08-2012, 09:50 PM
If I understand my tech training correctly, DSL is more of a dedicated line giving you a fairly consistent speed. Cable is shared and speeds are influenced by traffic and the number of customers hooked to the same relay. My DSL may be slightly slower than the average cable customer, but my experience on cable connections hasn't been that impressive. I currently pay $35 for the fastest DSL connection.
.

DSL is just a protocol that allows higher bandwidths of data to go to from your computer to a central mux probably down your street somewhere. It originated in the copper phone line to your house as a way to put high speed data on a telephone copper cable for a short distance. From there its MUX'd into a T1, T3 or fiber and goes to some other larger hub and connects to the internet.

You are correct that cable companies can share many people on a cable. Particularly, during it's infancy, a lot of cable connections would be shared going to a central hub. In my case, today, my cable goes directly to a hub in my neighbors back yard. Nobody is sharing the coax with me which is where the slowing down of many users on a coax cable slowed down things in the past.

I suspect in a lot of rural areas, cable is being shared, but both the cable and traditional telephone carriers are working hard to get fiber to the curb which will eventually turn into fiber to the home.

There could be a few inaccuracies in the above as I have been out of that industry for a number of years now, but it should be pretty accurate.

Again, in my case, I have both the local phone company, Verizon, and my cable company both offering "fiber to the curb".

MyITGuy
06-11-2012, 04:51 PM
1. Paying for commercial television: It's the biggest con job ever. To think that it has been legislated that the only choice you have is a crappy conversion box with questionable quality or paying for cable is ridiculous. If you had told me years ago that I'd be paying $80 a month to be advertised to, I would have laughed at you. When this whole thing started, the premise was that you were paying for non commercial television and specialty programming. HBO, Showtime, etc. Now they have slowly conned us into paying for local stations, and high definition commercials. It's a total rip off.
I would agree with you on this point...however I also have a whole house DVR system that allows me to record/watch TV on my schedule, which also means I can skip commercials.


2. High Speed Internet: The whole idea of rationing out the speed, and pricing it based on levels is a total con job. They are actually limiting the natural speed of the connection to squeeze more money of the line. Just provide the service as best you can and set one price. Whywould you spend money on extra hardware to only get $40 a month out of a connection, when you can just let it run naturally and get $50 a month from everyone?

The choices of A. "Do you want a connection?". B. "Do you want it to work?", and C. "Do you want it fast enough to actually do anything?", is infuriating. My cable provider offers 10mbps for $40. 20mbps for $50, and then 50mbps for $120. Nothing in between and even though I like and need the 50mbps, it's extremely overpriced. And they know it. And they know I know it.
Companies use this method in order to determine the capacity they need to provide the services you want.
Lets say we have two customers:
Customer A who only uses the internet for web/email and is extremely satisfied with 10Mbps and paying $40/mo
Customer B who uses the internet for media streaming, gaming, website uploads/downloads and etc and is currently running at 50Mbps and paying $100/mo

What do you think would happen if companies "just let it run naturally" and charged everyone the same price (I.E. $75/mo for 50Mbps)?
Customer A would be extremely upset because they do not see the value in the additional speed/price increase
Customer B would also be upset because now the bandwidth is being oversold more than it is today, and customers who previously couldn't afford this tier are now beginning to utilize the speed/bandwidth available causing the network to be strained.



3. Phone: $10 extra a month for a voip line sounds like a good deal, until you realize that they are charging for long distance calls like it's 1999. Who, in the age of Vonage, Magic Jack, and unlimited mobile plans can justify still charging for long distance by the minute?

Any reasonable company that is expecting to make a profit, without threatening to terminate the users account if they exceed X amount of minutes. With most of these companies you may find your services terminated if you go over 3,000 minutes.
Additionally, keep in mind that your local telco/cable companies are regulated by the government on what they can/can't do as far as your phone service and also have additional costs in terms of emergency services that they need to provide. The VoIP companies you referenced don't necessarily have to play by these same rules which does have an impact on the pricing offered.

MyITGuy
06-11-2012, 05:25 PM
If I understand my tech training correctly, DSL is more of a dedicated line giving you a fairly consistent speed. Cable is shared and speeds are influenced by traffic and the number of customers hooked to the same relay.
Pretty much on track, however all connections are shared at some point regardless of the technology.

DSL utilizes copper pairs which are dedicated to you and are carried back to the DSLAM which then are sent back to the main office/noc via a high speed line (Copper T1/T3 or Fiber connectivity).
DSL Provides a maximum speed of up to 12Mbps downstream, however a provider can get higher speeds by utilizing more copper pairs (I.E. ADSL2 can get up to 24Mbps downstream), and is also limited by the distance of your dedicated pair along with any equipment/repairs made along the way to this line.

Cable on the other hand is a shared system, meaning that a single Coax line is run underground or on telephone poles, which is then split to accommodate each new customer in the area. These Coax lines then run back to a central node that serves your neighborhood, where the data is then sent back to the main office/noc via a high speed line (A Coax run or Fiber Connectivity).
Cable provides a maximum speed of up to 42Mbps downstream, however a provider can get higher speeds by allocating additional "channels/frequencies" (I.E. A DOCSIS 3.0 Node can provide up to 343Mbps by allocating 8 downstream channels). The only real limitations to a cable system is the bandwidth available between the node and main office/noc, and how much of this bandwidth is being utilized by Standard/HD TV Channels.


My DSL may be slightly slower than the average cable customer, but my experience on cable connections hasn't been that impressive. I currently pay $35 for the fastest DSL connection.
I've never really had any major issues with either technology, both have been fairly rock solid in terms of the performance/speeds advertised...however the DSL speeds available in my area are extremely slow in terms of today's requirements (At least in my opinion).
The best AT&T DSL Line I can get is U-Verse High Speed Internet Max at $48, which only gives me 12Mbps of downstream bandwidth (And 768Kbps upstream IIRC)
Meanwhile I'm paying $45 for Brighthouse Lightning, which gives me 40Mbps of downstream bandwidth, and 5Mbps of upstream bandwidth.

I run speed tests every now and then and never have any problems obtaining the speeds that are advertised.

nealrm
06-17-2012, 12:12 AM
We turned off our pay TV. Went back to over the air. Quality is a lot better than when I grew up, but not as good as dish or cable. But it is free.

We do have a Roku 2. The best device I have used in a long time. Plug it in and it works. You get Netflick, Hulu and a bunch of other channels. Some pay per view, some subscription, some free. There are games too.

I also have a Samsung Blue Ray with internet. Worst internet device ever. Always having problems connecting, constant rebuffering.


As for paying too much. Cable and dish service is a luxury item. Turn it off.

Harold Mansfield
06-18-2012, 11:17 AM
I have all of the tools and accounts to go cable TV free...but I still need the internet connection to pull most of it off and THAT is the most overpriced of all of the services.
I'll figure out how to set it all up and pay less, sooner of later.

billbenson
06-18-2012, 02:44 PM
Do you have more than one option? I have the telephone company and the cable company both offering the same services and technology competing with each other where I live.

Harold Mansfield
06-18-2012, 05:48 PM
I have more than one option for phone. You can get phone anywhere. And for TV there's Direct TV, and Century Link. It's the internet connection that's the stickler.
Only one cable company and I'm just not convinced that DSL is going to offer me the speed and consistency that I need.

I think I'm over paying for internet by at least $40 a month. I really think it's truly only worth around $75 a month.

billbenson
06-18-2012, 09:28 PM
Here both the cable company and phone company offer all services and its fiber to the curb so there is no cable sharing. That doesn't include the dish network. Surprised I have that in this little bumpkin town and you don't have it in Vegas?

Harold Mansfield
06-20-2012, 11:03 AM
Here both the cable company and phone company offer all services and its fiber to the curb so there is no cable sharing. That doesn't include the dish network. Surprised I have that in this little bumpkin town and you don't have it in Vegas?

We do. Cox, Century Link, and Direct TV all offer Phone, TV, and Internet. Only Cox offers cable/high speed. The rest offer DSL.
I assume I have my own box outside...when I have an issue they always refer to "my box", but I live in a condo so I can't be sure. I always assmumed I at least shared a box with the 4 other units in my building

But even with "to the curb" it's still coming through relay stations or hubs. It's not as if it's a line straight from the cable company location to your house.

MyITGuy
06-20-2012, 11:53 AM
I assume I have my own box outside...when I have an issue they always refer to "my box", but I live in a condo so I can't be sure. I always assmumed I at least shared a box with the 4 other units in my building
That box is the demarcation point/network interface unit where their responsibility for maintaining the infrastructure ends (Unless you have inside wire maintenance). This box isn't the same type that's referred to above (I.E. DSLAMs/Nodes) which are much bigger in size.