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SCUBA9097
10-08-2011, 12:45 AM
What would be considered "out there" as far as pricing goes? I'm getting ready to move to FL here in a few weeks and thought it would be a good idea to get the tri-fold brochure done. I sent a copy of the brochure I designed to a writer and explained that the copy I had written was only to give an idea of the topics and general feel of where I wanted to go with it. I also explained that he was free to rewrite as he saw fit, as this was his area of expertise.

This job didn't involve any graphic design or layout, just writing copy and he gave me an estimate of $1,600.00 :eek:

Am I that out of touch or was this a high estimate?

Business Attorney
10-08-2011, 09:51 AM
That seems really high for the text for a single tri-fold brochure, based on what I have paid working through our marketing consultant. If you think it is high, the best way to check is to ask one or two other good writers for a quote on the same tri-fold, without sharing the amount of the quote you have already received. If they are all in the same range, then that is probably a reasonable cost for what you are looking for.

Spider
10-08-2011, 09:59 AM
Well, doesn't it depend on the results? If Mr.$1600 can get you three times the sales that Mr.$800 gets you, Mr.$1600 is the cheapest.

Question is - how can you discover what the results will be before the event?

Patrysha
10-08-2011, 11:56 AM
It is higher than what I charge, but lower than what some of my friends who work corporate and through agencies would charge...

SCUBA9097
10-08-2011, 02:43 PM
Thank you for the input! I wasn't sure what an "average" price point would be.

It's rough when you have absolutely no budget for things that you know are important. For now I'll just send what I have to the printer to do a low number.

Karon Thackston
10-09-2011, 08:06 AM
Question is - how can you discover what the results will be before the event?

You ask for proof of performance (http://www.marketingwords.com/blog/?p=110), that's how. I don't mean testimonials from people who say "I really like the brochure he wrote for me." I am talking about quantifiable proof that this person's copy is worth considerably more than others charge. If he can provide the proof that you'll probably get better results than using another writer, go for it! If not, keep shopping.

KristineS
10-10-2011, 12:51 PM
I'm with Karon on this one. Results can be quantified, and if this guy is worth the $1600 he wants to charge, then he should be able to point to instances where he wrote a brochure for someone, or revamped a brochure for someone, or a website or whatever, and results were better after he did his work than they were before.

lowbudgetcopywriting
10-14-2011, 11:26 PM
Hiring a writer is hard.

- How many revisions does he offer?
- How much experience does he have in your niche? (firearms, right?)
- Is he willing to work with you on any kind of testing?
- And (important) what does his portfolio look like?

I like that you took the initiative and started writing the copy. Your passion, your knowledge of the industry and your familiarity with the target audience is crucial to the brochure's ability to attract customers.

At $1600 I would expect a lot of personal attention and a creative brief that you can keep and use to help define your marketing strategy.

Here's sage advice I give to people who are seeking a lawyer, a plumber, an auto repair shop or a copywriter: Always get three estimates! :)

- Matt

limekwat
10-17-2011, 07:33 PM
$1,600 is more than 5 times as much as we charge for that amount of copy. :eek: You should definitely shop around and look at your other options. I've heard of copywriters charging that much for sales letters, since they're made to close sales then and there, but tri-fold brochures are purely informational in most cases, and are therefore only a small component of a sale. For the money your writer is asking for, I'd expect a tri-fold that can raise the dead!

LFinkle
10-18-2011, 07:46 AM
Seems high to me. I have used copy writers that charge $20 an hour with great results, but it depends on the copywriter. What's most important is to find one that has your voice...that sounds like you. I've had copy written that in no way sounds like me and it was a waste of money. I'd search for others and ask for samples of their work first. Even at $100 an hour for a copy writer that's 16 hours of writing, seems like a lot to me

Dan Furman
10-19-2011, 12:10 PM
That's a little high to me. Personally, I think $500-$700 for a trifold is fair, depending on the content / intent of the piece.

@ LFinkle... $20 an hour? You're getting an offshore Indian writer, a part-time college student, or similar for that money. I'm sure there's an occasional gem there, but for the most part, that's not a price point I'd recommend shopping in. Just my .02.

Dan Furman
10-19-2011, 12:16 PM
My comments in bold


Hiring a writer is hard.

- How many revisions does he offer? In most cases, a good writer shouldn't need more than one. However, if I am writing for a roomful of people who will all give input, I'll extend multiple revisions (and build such into my quote.)
- How much experience does he have in your niche? (firearms, right?) Somewhat irrelevent. A good copywriter can research and write about almost anything. If you limit yourself to people who have specifics in your industry, the list will get rather small.
- Is he willing to work with you on any kind of testing? Are you willing to PAY for someone to work on testing? It costs more time - therefore, more $$
- And (important) what does his portfolio look like? I agree - this is important. Real samples, real testimonials (w/ names and links)

I like that you took the initiative and started writing the copy. Your passion, your knowledge of the industry and your familiarity with the target audience is crucial to the brochure's ability to attract customers.

At $1600 I would expect a lot of personal attention and a creative brief that you can keep and use to help define your marketing strategy. (for that money, I would too! :) )

Here's sage advice I give to people who are seeking a lawyer, a plumber, an auto repair shop or a copywriter: Always get three estimates! :) (again, I agree)

- Matt

SCUBA9097
10-23-2011, 12:32 AM
There's absolutely no way I could afford $1,600.00 at this point, but getting that kind of response from him was shocking to say the least. Thinking about it though, if you remove my statement of "here's a general idea", perhaps he thought I was going to be one of those guys who submitted something to him, had him make corrections/changes, then turn around and say "I'm not paying the full amount... I did most of the work! You just tweeked it a little."

I thought it would have been a good way of creating a "jumping off point" for the brochure, but perhaps it was taken the wrong way. For now I'll just have the printers run a few hundred copies of what I've written, then get it done correctly once the business takes off in the new location.

erichtoll
10-24-2011, 03:03 PM
It's a bit like buying a car, isn't it. A Neon is quite a bit different from a Lexus.

I would ask to see a number of writing samples, and then get quotes/samples from others.

And the deciding factor - whose writing is most likely to get the reader to take your desired action...

CopywritingTony
06-11-2012, 09:08 AM
You ask for proof of performance (http://www.marketingwords.com/blog/?p=110), that's how. I don't mean testimonials from people who say "I really like the brochure he wrote for me." I am talking about quantifiable proof that this person's copy is worth considerably more than others charge. If he can provide the proof that you'll probably get better results than using another writer, go for it! If not, keep shopping.

I know copywriters that charge $25k for something similar.
But the price is completely irrelevant. What is the END-RESULT
that you want? Is it more sales? Leads?...

Also, if you don't have a great product that PEOPLE WANT,
then what's the point?

You can have the greatest copy in the world but, if the product
isn't going to the target market... Then why bother?

As far as "proof" goes... I don't show proof of my clients results
for private reasons and I would honor the same courtesy for a
new client.

BiznessAsUsual
07-25-2012, 12:16 PM
A professional copywriter could do that for only a few bucks!

Here is the key to keeping your costs down...
Always work with a professional copywriter who does FREELANCE work on the side. If you work with a company, and not a freelance writer, you will overpay. $1,600 for a brochure? Give me a break. As a copywriter myself, I can tell you that you are getting ripped off. Hope this helps.

AccountantSalary
07-26-2012, 12:17 AM
I'm looking at the 2011 Writer's Market and it states that for brochures, booklets and flyers, the average going rate if $4,215 per project, with a low of $300 and a high of $15,000. The average hourly rate is $81, with a low of $30 and a high of $150.

Dan Furman
07-26-2012, 07:42 PM
Always work with a professional copywriter who does FREELANCE work on the side.

Have to disagree. A good, professional copywriter is almost always a 100% freelance copywriter / company owner. Not someone who does stuff "on the side". In general terms, that's not a pro (think about it logically - shouldn't a professional copywriter be able to make their own website convert enough to make a living?)

Dan Furman
07-26-2012, 11:22 PM
I'm looking at the 2011 Writer's Market and it states that for brochures, booklets and flyers, the average going rate if $4,215 per project, with a low of $300 and a high of $15,000. The average hourly rate is $81, with a low of $30 and a high of $150.

The hourly rate sounds about right (I think a good copywriter is worth what any other professional's time is worth - accountant, mechanic, plumber, etc)

For the project prices, I suspect high level corporations / larger booklets skew that upwards.

billbenson
07-27-2012, 03:08 PM
Have to disagree. A good, professional copywriter is almost always a 100% freelance copywriter / company owner. Not someone who does stuff "on the side". In general terms, that's not a pro (think about it logically - shouldn't a professional copywriter be able to make their own website convert enough to make a living?)

I don't think this is what you meant to say, but it sounds like corporations don't have professional copywriters who do stuff on the side.

While its natural for you to have your own business, some (most unfortunately) need the structure of working for a company and don't start their own business. But corporate copywriters may be good, stick their name on forums and do stuff on the side for a few extra bucks? Salary's in the corporate world pretty much suck these days. I bet that includes copywriters?

Dan Furman
07-27-2012, 08:51 PM
I don't think this is what you meant to say, but it sounds like corporations don't have professional copywriters who do stuff on the side.

While its natural for you to have your own business, some (most unfortunately) need the structure of working for a company and don't start their own business. But corporate copywriters may be good, stick their name on forums and do stuff on the side for a few extra bucks? Salary's in the corporate world pretty much suck these days. I bet that includes copywriters?

Perhaps. Although I think corporate copywriters (I know a few) do pretty well. Well enough that doing this for $20 here and there really wouldn't be worth it. But to each their own, I suppose.

I do have an entrepreneur mentality - I almost cannot understand the other side, really :)

billbenson
07-28-2012, 11:57 AM
Perhaps. Although I think corporate copywriters (I know a few) do pretty well. Well enough that doing this for $20 here and there really wouldn't be worth it. But to each their own, I suppose.

I do have an entrepreneur mentality - I almost cannot understand the other side, really :)

Seems like skilled corporate jobs these days seem to be 60k plus or minus. I made about 100k as a sales guy in 1982. That seems to be the same today. Of course there are exceptions.

My 22 years working for real companies I mostly worked out to my house. The thought of going into an office to work today would about kill me.

Ltemodel
08-24-2012, 07:54 PM
I think there are two different types of copywriters out there. One writes the "this is who we are and this is what we do" type of copy and the other writes to sell product. For the "this is who we are" type of copy... $20 per hour is probably right and the $1600 is way to high.

For the copy writers who do days and days of research on the market and the customers buying mentality just to hit their hot buttons and make the company money through copy... $1600 is probably too cheap.

It all depends the reason for putting the words on the paper.

Dan Furman
08-27-2012, 04:22 PM
I think there are two different types of copywriters out there. One writes the "this is who we are and this is what we do" type of copy and the other writes to sell product. For the "this is who we are" type of copy... $20 per hour is probably right and the $1600 is way to high.

For the copy writers who do days and days of research on the market and the customers buying mentality just to hit their hot buttons and make the company money through copy... $1600 is probably too cheap.

It all depends the reason for putting the words on the paper.

the who we are and what we do IS the sales copy for many businesses. That's actually *not* the place to skimp.

To me, there are two types of copywriters, though. The companies that provide a lot of copy cheap, and those that write really good copy. There's a use for both. If you want 100 SEO articles on your site that you really don't plan to have anyone read too in-depth, then cheap is the way to go. If you want to convert, cheap likely won't do it.

webmarketingpro
09-26-2012, 01:42 AM
That's a little high to me. Personally, I think $500-$700 for a trifold is fair, depending on the content / intent of the piece.

@ LFinkle... $20 an hour? You're getting an offshore Indian writer, a part-time college student, or similar for that money. I'm sure there's an occasional gem there, but for the most part, that's not a price point I'd recommend shopping in. Just my .02.

Thank you for saying that, Dan! I totally agree! While price is never a guarantee (there's really no such thing), you are very likely to get what you pay for, and you're unlikely to get a really good copywriter for $20.

And getting a barely serviceable copywriter could cause real damage...

Elisabeth