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Harold Mansfield
08-03-2010, 11:52 AM
One of the things I noticed about successful entrepreneurs is that many of them had failures before they had any success and those failures were actually helpful.

I definitely failed at a few things before I finally got going with what I'm doing now. I actually came across some of my old business plans, and cards from other stuff that I tried to start but had no idea what I was doing...and it got me thinking about how far I've come yet how far I still have to go.

Years ago I tried my hand at brokering notes or selling paper. Probably should have stuck that one out since at the time there was a lot of money in bundling mortgages and structured payments and selling them to larger buyers for a lump sum.

At the time I spent more time and money on the image of the company than actually doing the work and getting some deals under my belt. Needless to say, I was eaten alive, starved and had to cut my losses and realize that I was out of my area.

Before that I wanted to start a local magazine. Business plan, revenue projections, design, printing...had it all worked out. Even got some meetings with interested investors. None of them bit.
I look back at it now and see that I was selling the idea of a having a magazine, but not any hard data on actually running one. Thank God that one didn't work out since the web was coming on strong and would have killed it within a year or 2.

Each taught me something valuable and to concentrate on what was important, and I have been able to incorporate some of those ideas and failures into what I do now where I am actually paying the bills.
The one thing that I always had was the realization that working for other people was out of the question and would continue to make me miserable and I had to keep trying.

Did any of you have any failures, or did you hit it right out off of the starting line and never looked back?

Dan Furman
08-03-2010, 12:02 PM
This is my "second and a half" attempt.

My first attempt was 1992-94. I did my own local direct mail coupons. I actually broke even for awhile, but in the end, my lack of "get out there and make sales" proved my undoing. I do not like cold-call sales, and I really couldn't find a quality person who wanted to work for my little startup on commission. I talk about this business and the lessons learned in "Start and Run a Real Home Based Business"

My second attempt was 1995-1996. I tried computer repair / early web advertising / etc. It was kind of a half-hearted attempt, as I was all over the place.

My third attempt was in 2000, and I'm still here. I suspect I would not be able to do this without the failures. I learned a ton.

One thing I have found interesting is many of the things I learned are hard to pass on to others. Not because I can't (hey, I wrote a pretty well-received book about it), but because first-time entrepreneurs really don't/won't listen - It's the same way you can tell teenagers that their 16 y/o romance failure is indeed NOT the end of the world, but they won't listen.

Which I get - I didn't listen either.

Four94
08-03-2010, 12:06 PM
This is my "second and a half" attempt.

My first attempt was 1992-94. I did my own local direct mail coupons. I actually broke even for awhile, but in the end, my lack of "get out there and make sales" proved my undoing. I do not like cold-call sales, and I really couldn't find a quality person who wanted to work for my little startup on commission. I talk about this business and the lessons learned in "Start and Run a Real Home Based Business"

My second attempt was 1995-1996. I tried computer repair / early web advertising / etc. It was kind of a half-hearted attempt, as I was all over the place.

My third attempt was in 2000, and I'm still here. I suspect I would not be able to do this without the failures. I learned a ton.

One thing I have found interesting is many of the things I learned are hard to pass on to others. Not because I can't (hey, I wrote a pretty well-received book about it), but because first-time entrepreneurs really don't/won't listen - It's the same way you can tell teenagers that their 16 y/o romance failure is indeed NOT the end of the world, but they won't listen.

Which I get - I didn't listen either.

I have been involved with 3 other startups that I wasn't the head of.
I was there at the formation of them.

Now I have my own ventures going on now.

Harold Mansfield
08-03-2010, 12:17 PM
One thing I have found interesting is many of the things I learned are hard to pass on to others. Not because I can't (hey, I wrote a pretty well-received book about it), but because first-time entrepreneurs really don't/won't listen - It's the same way you can tell teenagers that their 16 y/o romance failure is indeed NOT the end of the world, but they won't listen.

Which I get - I didn't listen either.

That's funny. The minute I read that I flashed back to me sitting at the local S.C.O.R.E office and mentally disagreeing with the advice that a couple of retired business execs were giving me. One ran a successful magazine ( which I was there to get advice about) for years.
Years later, once I got over myself and realized that no one really cared about my ideas, I find myself covering the basics exactly as they suggested years ago.

Four94
08-03-2010, 12:20 PM
I recommend a good book called "Rework".
It's a great read for anyone starting a business.

Mark

cbscreative
08-03-2010, 05:32 PM
For all the "old timers" here, you may already be familiar with my answer and at least parts of the story. But no, this is not my first biz.

That goes back about 24 years when I started a sign company which I ran for about 7 years. I got into that biz just a couple years before the computer takeover. When computers first started making headway into the sign industry, I thought that was great. I still think it was, but it brought some undesired side effects. Where sign guys either had talent or wouldn't consider becoming sign guys, we suddenly had a whole new breed of competition because the computer supposedly "allowed anyone to be an artist."

Many of these competitors were franchised sign shops...something that didn't previously exist. They sold crap and got away with it because they understood marketing (it was built into their franchise). I got tired of the whole routine and mostly took a sabbatical from the graphics industry. But one lesson from the experience did benefit me a lot.

I learned the importance of good marketing. If franchised sign shops could sell visual pollution and take business away from talented sign guys, it not only meant that talent wasn't enough, it meant that good marketing was powerful. Imagine the potential if you put good marketing behind a great product or service.

So when I started my current company over 8 years ago, I put my lessons to good use and placed an especially strong emphasis on marketing. In early 2002 when I started this company, the Internet was well on it's way to maturing. That brought changes to graphics, web design, and even business in general that dwarfs what I had to deal with in the sign industry. The difference now is that doesn't matter. So yes, that experience is crucial to the business I have now.

Best of all, it directly benefits my clients. They can go anywhere for just web design, graphics, and writing. Without the marketing element, I wouldn't bother with this biz any more. Focusing on marketing makes it fun and rewarding.

Patrysha
08-03-2010, 06:39 PM
This is my fourth official business, but I've been doing things for money that weren't necessarily a "job" since I was 14 (got a job first though at 13)...

My first business was an in home childcare...started 13 years, 1 month and 1 day ago :-) Eventually between that and freelance writing I ended up running a website & newsletter and produced a monthly curriculum for home childcare's. We broke even from the start but never really made a profit. I started doing what I do now (publicity, web development & ghostwriting...back then social media didn't exist though)...but I had trouble transitioning when we moved (hubby got a new job, I didn't have my driver's license yet and the new community was way too small to need anything I had to offer...so I gave that up with our next move and got a job selling radio adverstising...which lost it's lustre after the first year and the first job review where I was told I research too much and was too citified in my approach. I spent the next 10 months building my business to the point I thought it could sustain and build on and I left the workforce...

I thought for good.

Unfortunately, job loss for my husband combined with a few mis-steps and a couple of months ago I had to take a part time job. Blah!

Love the job, but it takes time away from business, but...needed something to boost income fast with hubby out of work. Summer is always slow for business...and I intentionally work around that since the kids are home. One thing I have learned over the years is to be flexible...

Blessed
08-03-2010, 07:15 PM
This is my first business - I started with some loyal printing salesmen who wanted me to keep doing their graphic work when I left the prepress department of the print shop after my daughter was born. I've been at it for 3 years now and I've tried all kinds of things - some of them have been profitable others have been flops. I'm getting a firm grasp on where I need to improve my skills, the type of marketing I need to do once I've spent some concentrated time working on a few specific skill sets and I'm finally at a point where I feel poised to take Crazy Dog to the next level - using marketing and etc... to expand my customer base.

I've got plans written down (finally) and a clear course of action that will begin probably around October this year. I'm excited!

Now... my parents did several "businesses" of their own that I was heavily involved with as a teenager and my husband has tried a few ventures on the side that I've always helped with too - you definitely can learn much from every experience!

cbscreative
08-03-2010, 07:16 PM
The one thing that I always had was the realization that working for other people was out of the question and would continue to make me miserable and I had to keep trying.

I meant to comment on this before. I suspect most of us share this quality. I know for sure I do.

Blessed
08-03-2010, 07:26 PM
I share the quality of not wanting to work for other people too. Especially now that I've worked for myself for the past few years.

I'm thankful that my husband has been able to earn enough to cover all of our necessary expenses through his regular full-time employment for someone else. My income covers emergencies and extra's - the flexibility that fact gives me is invaluable.

Steve B
08-04-2010, 05:13 AM
I've planned out several things - most of which didn't get to the operations stage. One recent failure was the exact thing that Dan described on the coupon business, except ours was a coupon magazine and it was more recent. It was tough for my wife and I to make the cold calls. We gave up on it when the economy tanked and businesses weren't paying and/or weren't willing to spend money on advertising.

I honestly don't remember any particular lessons I learned other than I wasn't motivated enough with any of those businesses to stick it out.

huggytree
08-04-2010, 06:55 AM
first attempt.

i saved for years to be able to do it...i only planned on 1 attempt.....i dont think i would like to work for someone else ever again, so if i fail ill be miserable...

i have enough to live on for 1 year, so when that money is gone its over...luckily that didnt happen (yet)

cbscreative
08-04-2010, 01:15 PM
We gave up on it when the economy tanked and businesses weren't paying and/or weren't willing to spend money on advertising.

I know many business people react that way to the economy, but that response is suicidal. Most companies who scale back on marketing and advertising just because things are tough don't make it through the tough times. The ones who do make it through are at a serious disadvantage and get buried by competitors who kept advertising. So even the economic recovery doesn't help those who make this mistake.

Yes, it's tougher to sell in a slow economy, but I'd rather work with those who realize the value. Those are the ones who will stay in business, get stronger, and keep coming back. Whether this is your first company or not, realizing this principle will help you avoid failure. If you study all the economic downturns of the past, you will see the pattern. Using the economy as an excuse to cut out marketing and advertising has led to the demise of many businesses.

KristineS
08-04-2010, 01:20 PM
Haven't gone out on my own yet, although I'm getting much closer to giving it a shot. My main hurdle right now is health care. With my health issues I need to have health insurance, and those very issues make getting private insurance pretty expensive. So that's a big thing I need to figure out.

I am very much more able to understand not wanting to work for someone else now than I have been in the past. Dealing with other people's crazy will do that to you.

Harold Mansfield
08-04-2010, 04:37 PM
I know many business people react that way to the economy, but that response is suicidal. Most companies who scale back on marketing and advertising just because things are tough don't make it through the tough times. The ones who do make it through are at a serious disadvantage and get buried by competitors who kept advertising. So even the economic recovery doesn't help those who make this mistake.

Yes, it's tougher to sell in a slow economy, but I'd rather work with those who realize the value. Those are the ones who will stay in business, get stronger, and keep coming back. Whether this is your first company or not, realizing this principle will help you avoid failure. If you study all the economic downturns of the past, you will see the pattern. Using the economy as an excuse to cut out marketing and advertising has led to the demise of many businesses.

For all purposes, I don't technically have a dime. I'm still new and work comes in just fast enough to keep the bills paid and get a beer every now and then, but I am feeling the itch to do some kind of advertising...even if I have to cut back even more on other things.

First I need to organize my process a little more to be able to handle multiple clients at once just in case any advertisement brings a boost in calls.

cbscreative
08-04-2010, 05:04 PM
Harold, your point helps illustrate the different business models and how marketing and advertising varies. In your case, a little goes a long way and you have the right attitude. A one person or very low overhead operation can do well on a lean budget. I believe everyone needs to be doing something, and it needs to be appropriate to the business, so I wouldn't want to imply every business should be investing thousands a month.

It does baffle me though when a business owner has the fortitude to grow a company into a decent size, hire a bunch of people, and then cut out advertising and marketing when the economy tanks. They now have to keep all these people busy, otherwise they lay off or even go out of business. When things are tough is when they need to be the most aggressive. Sometimes though, those decisions are being made by someone who didn't actually build the business.

Patrysha
08-04-2010, 06:05 PM
See I think there are some businesses advertising that should be concentrating more of their energies on training staff, improving displays and cleanliness, and stick to low key direct advertising done well rather than the ridiculous amounts they are spending on media buys.There are good reasons to cut an advertising budget and deal with the basics.

I think too many business owners think they can advertise their way out of bad service. I also think small business owners rely too much on their ad sales reps to guide them.

cbscreative
08-04-2010, 06:26 PM
Excellent points, Patrysha. Any wheel that isn't balanced is going to wobble.

lav
08-04-2010, 06:44 PM
My first business was a success (surprising I know). I ran it for eight years before another company bought me out. They wanted my clients and employees mainly and werent worried about the name of the business or machinery. My second business failed miserably, after 6 months I decided to start fresh, I believe the concept was good but I lost focus a little and forgot how hard it is to start from scratch. My third business current one is now doing well but I have had to make some considerable changes within the first 12 months. Things like a name change and the way I market it have been big changes but I'd rather do it now while the business is infant then have to do it down the track.

One thing I think that made my first business successful is that I had a very clear plan of what I was trying to achieve with the business right from the start. I put goals in place and was cocerned primarily with achieving those goals long term. My second business that failed I wanted what I had built with my first business but without allowing a big enough time frame. I wanted it all right there and then.

My biggest lessons learnt were-

1: learn how to sell........ and I dont just mean face to face selling I mean work out what is going to make people buy from you, have a strategy. You can have the best products around but if they dont sell they are worthless.

2: It takes time- you need to walk before you run. Dont just think about getting work for next week, you need to think about getting work for the next 3 years. To do this you also need to sit down and plan how you are going to achieve this, set goals and make the priority of the business to work towards those goals. If you are a small company then start small dont take on a thousand different products and services, stick with what you know best and find a way to market that first otherwise you wont be confident or efficient, you will feel overwhelmed and your clients will see that.

3: Do only your best work and sell only products you are certain are good value- The best advertising anyone can get is word of mouth and referrals. People talk.

huggytree
08-04-2010, 10:52 PM
eborg,

if you arent making any money why be in business?....without the financial reward i wouldnt even consider it....raise your prices

Harold Mansfield
08-04-2010, 11:05 PM
eborg,

if you arent making any money why be in business?....without the financial reward i wouldnt even consider it....raise your prices

I didn't say I wasn't making any money, but it hasn't even been a year yet. Cut me some slack...am I supposed to be shopping for a 5 bdrm 3 and a half bath house and a BMW already?
I don't think anyone else struck a stride that fast.

I'm surprised that I am able to pay the bills so fast after the hit I took last year in affiliate commissions.

Lyrafire
08-05-2010, 10:49 PM
This is not my first business. I owned a reasonably successful tutoring business, did radio, television and newspaper advertising to launch it, and I made a decent living. Then I started another biz, but failed when my life blew up. So I guess that makes this my third business, unless I count my years in real estate.

sequoiapayroll
08-07-2010, 01:59 PM
This is my first business on my own. However, I have run a few businesses for other people so I was able to makesome of my mistakes before I started my own venture. The biggest obstacle I have had is getting to an "established" point, where I can actually run the business and reduce time spent "building" a business. Building a business is so much different than running one. It is a little more than I expected, but I am up for the challenge.

Lyrafire
08-10-2010, 11:53 AM
It's a lot of work, that's for sure. After everything is in place--your systems, policies, website, blog and so forth, you still have to get the word out. Unless you have a good deal of money and can just pay for advertising, getting the word out is a job all by itself. And then of course, the blogging is another job. You could forgo a blog, I suppose, but they appear to be part of every successful business's marketing plan now. And in my line--freelance writing--I think one or more blogs is a must. They're a good way to showcase my skills.

That said, I've been writing for Demand Studios for so long that now I discover my writing voice has been affected. I automatically go into DS style--not a good way to showcase my skills. Though they have a very successful business model, they want a voiceless, just-the-facts approach. If you do anything colorful it probably won't get by the content editors, one of whom will send it back for a rewrite. Or they strip it out themselves and sometimes leave embarrassing grammatical and factual errors in their wake. No wonder I feel so burnt out. The good news is that realizing this, I'm reclaiming my voice(s), and that feels so liberating.

Superbad
08-17-2010, 09:51 AM
I just read a book analysing lives and minds of 100 richest people in the world and one common thing for all of them was failure. At least one early failure for each one of them :-)

I hope I am done with that!

Big Col
08-18-2010, 02:08 AM
I was sitting down with my morning coffee dreading a few dozen cold calls that I'm about to make and stumbled onto this thread. Although I only came here to procrastinate I'm so glad I did because all of this has picked me up and made me excited to get on the phone.

We launched a product 3 days ago and I was getting weary because of the long hours pre-launch and the lack of a sale so far! Pretty short sighted now that I think of it.

CHEERS ALL!

greenoak
08-18-2010, 08:19 AM
this is our second....the first was a partnership with 2 other men.... and ended finally when the discount store came to town took our main product...records and totally undersold us..we had to close and dh andi paid off all the debt...about 2000$.....i learned so much from all that...no more partners, how cruel the market is, the value of wholesale, the value of richer customers..being regional instead of local....being outside the corporate box, where a big company can ruin everything......i started greenoak during the last couple of years at the record store, ...and dh worked a side job for a couple of years then...then the store started growing and growing and for about 10 yrs it was just he and i and no workers ...now we have quite a few workers and are in our 32nd year at greenoak....
both businesses had lots of compartments or side businesses within them, thngs that made us flexible and able to cash in on one thng when another lagged.......
our first store has a page on facebook where they still talk about our record store and how much they liked being there and buying my earrings...its just a sweet thing to me....but it went under in the 80s.......
luckily i have never worked for anyone else since the 70s for about a year......thats been the constant plus to having my own business...
what always gets me is the serendipity of some real good things, like me meeting the right buyers when we first started...
and the unintended consequernces
and the value of networking and good relations with customers....and long term relations....

Harold Mansfield
08-18-2010, 11:51 AM
Anne that's a great story because it shows your entrepreneurial spirit and second because it was a good thing that the record store closed for other reasons rather than holding on until it closed anyway. Record stores are pretty much done today. And the way the cards fell gave you a good head start (right place, right time) on Greenoak to build it into what it is today.

You ever think about having a section of Greenoak for vintage albums? Maybe just a rack or two. Seems like ti would be a good fit.

greenoak
08-18-2010, 06:20 PM
yes we have that...our partnerr died a year ago and we bought his records at auction.....so ecletic...leonard cohen, ramones, lou reed , alice cooper...david bowie....and lots of others...wow the covers!!!! when that all came in lots of folks were happy to dig thru...at 2$$ each...also have lots of rock mags from the 70s and 80s...
to me business is a grand experiment and exploration....and im lucky to have a partner ...dh...who can balance things out and do the boring stuff..and a son whol likes it as much as i do and is as hard a worker as me too.....
now dh is supposed to be learning thunderbird!! to solve our email troubles...we'll see.