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corcor67
09-28-2009, 04:46 PM
I began a thread explaining what I wish to accomplish for a buisness, part of which is an online store to sell products. I was told by another member my post would be better placed under this forum to get help with the web site. He suggested I set up an information site, build some content with articles with a comment/question area for feedback. I like the idea, I don't have the funds or local demand for the business to actually set up a physical store so I want to keep it on the net for the time being. I have heard of some places offering websites for free but you can purchase the domain and hosting later if you want, would this be a bad idea or a good place to start out?

vangogh
09-28-2009, 07:58 PM
I think you're better off purchasing the domain and hosting and not going for the free site options. They tend to limit what you can do and make it harder than it first seems to later move things to your own server.

A domain costs $10 a year. If you can't afford that you're going to have problems staying in business. Decent hosting can be found anywhere from $5 to $10 a month. Again that's not a huge expense for a business.

As for the site there are plenty of ways to get a free one. Now I think a custom design is the better option, but in the beginning you can go with a free option if it's all you can afford. There are a variety of content management systems that are open source and cost $0. My preference is WordPress, but it's hardly the only option. Most of these systems will have communities around them that develop free themes, which are essentially the look of the site. In fact many hosting accounts will have options to install WordPress (or other) with a few clicks and WordPress has made installing themes rather easy.

In the end you can have your own site on your own hosting account for around $100/year. If your business is going to be viable you need to be able to invest something in it. $100 is not a lot to invest. Even if you hired someone else to install WordPress and a theme for you the cost wouldn't be that much more.

You have to be willing to invest in your business.

Patrysha
09-28-2009, 07:59 PM
Stay away from free if you can.

A domain will set you back a whopping $10.00 a year and hosting around $10/month for a good starter host. So it's not a whole lot of money to invest to get things going.

As for local sales, you said in another thread that your town is small, but you might want to consider a booth at things like home business fairs, tradeshows and so on in the next town over.

corcor67
09-28-2009, 09:29 PM
Yes i am willing to invest, a bit tight on the cash situation right now but that should pass shortly, I am willing to set up a site I just wasn't sure if the free ones were worth my time, i actually just got one set up using a different browser on my phone right before I read this... :s ... anything i can do with it to help my future site or just delete it?

a booth might help get some people in the area interested in bonsai, might have to try that out

cbscreative
09-28-2009, 10:38 PM
Corey, from your posts, it looks like an informational site might be at least part of your solution to your business goals. Since this is a serious hobby for you, you probably know a lot about it and could do many of the things being suggested here.

What I am about to suggest will put a lot of homework on your plate, but it may also open up a whole new world of opportunities. The real beauty of it is that it will have you mapping the whole thing out in advance so you don't have to make so many of the mistakes that are common in starting a business, especially an online business (I agree the Internet is the way for you to go on this one).

Check out my page on building your own web site (http://www.cbscreative.com/webdiy.htm). It will lead you to some resources that will allow you to proceed with realistic expectations, and plan according to a proven pattern of success. Even if it's not the method you choose, you will have gained a lot from the information.

corcor67
09-28-2009, 11:21 PM
Thanks for the link, i have it bookmarked for reading. I could do the informational page but need to work on my writing skills a bit, I still have a job and will be laid off for 4 months over the winter, if I can't manage to get anything going in the next month or two, I will have plenty of time to get the ball rolling in my off time.

vangogh
09-29-2009, 12:27 AM
Corey a site doesn't have to cost you much. I think eventually you'll want to hire someone to design a professional site, but you can get by at first without one. Definitely buy a domain. A domain is your internet property. If you move your site from one domain to another it's like picking up in the middle of the night and moving your store across town. And if you don't do things right, it's like moving without telling anyone.

Hosting your own site on your own domain also lets people know you're in business for real. When it's on a free site it sends an image that the site is a hobby site or it's a site that's here now, but maybe not tomorrow. Hosting isn't expensive. You really are looking at about $100 a year for the domain and the hosting.

WordPress is a fairly easy system to work with. If you can write something using Microsoft Word you can write something in WordPress. There's a little more to learn about the interface to know you're way around, but there are a great many tutorials online. You're also free to ask me any questions as I work with WordPress a lot. Other people here work with it a lot too and can walk you through many things. There's a large and active development community around WordPress meaning there's a ton of free themes for different designs and free plugins which add functionality to the site.

billbenson
09-29-2009, 04:20 AM
Corey, you said I believe, in your first thread, that you were a web designer. It seems you and others here are steering you to start out with a web based business that can grow into other areas. Can you give us an overview of your web skills to point you in the right direction. There are designers and web developers here who can point you in the right direction or at least keep you from waisting a lot of time in the wrong direction. We know you know your product. It sounds like you need to study the marketing side of selling on the web a bit. I know Vangogh above has a ton of resources and blogs to help you out, but we really need to know what you do and don't know to steer you in the right direction.

Other than the thread title, free hasn't been mentioned by you. If you know web design, there is absolutely no reason to go this route. This includes things liike Yahoo stores. A very bad long term idea. We can expand on that.

Have you registered and set up domains? Do you have a host you like. Can you create databases in control panel, can you edit php, do you know how databases work? All questions that can give us an idea in how to steer you in the right direction.

Oh, independent of your web skills, don't count on money for 6 months to a year. If you can't take the time, you will probably loose. You have a great opportunity with a free off season to do design. Without knowing a lot about web marketing, if you put together a good informational site during that time, you can't go wrong. Sure there are things that you may say down the road that you could have done better, but everybody has hindsight.

corcor67
09-29-2009, 06:26 AM
nope, no web designing skills...I don't know html or any other language for that matter, I have zero skills when it comes to web design, I am doing my best to read up on all the aspects of beginning a business online but felt like I may be missing some things, this is why I came here...I am well aware this has a good chance to not make it, but I want to try, I don't want to be sitting at work for the rest of my life wondering "what if?" I'm not that kind of person....I think "what if?" and I try it out. I have found a great deal of information coming from this forum, makes me wonder what would have happened if I hadn't found it...I know there is a lot for me to learn yet, I will do my best and have realized I may need to hire a web designer for the web site, I could try to learn to do it myself...This forum has given me much to think about, and I appericiate all the help.

cbscreative
09-29-2009, 11:01 AM
It's that "What if" question that drives all of us. By joining here, you've found a group who feel just like you do. I'd rather fail than never try and end up wondering "what if" for a lifetime. I can tell by the way you post that you will never be content just working for the man.

billbenson
09-29-2009, 12:25 PM
nope, no web designing skills

oops, confused two threads.

corcor67
09-29-2009, 12:38 PM
Yes I would rather be a failure at something I love than a success at something I hate.

I tend to get a bit off topic at times, this post is a good example of that. Back to the freebie deal...I understand I should do the pay for site for my business, but as I mentioned I created an account with a free website thing. I have been thinking about it and if I could use it or just dump it. The thought I had for it was for a blog, I would talk about some of the things I like and dislike about buying bonsai online, and get fellow artists to explain some things they would like to see changed, not mentioning I am planning to start a business so they feel more comfortable sharing their views, likes and dislikes about buying online...just try to gather some information as to what the customer would like to see in a company...worth it or dump it?

corcor67
09-29-2009, 12:40 PM
thats ok bill...im sure with this discussion going on in two different threads it would get a bit confusing

vangogh
09-29-2009, 08:37 PM
I've created accounts at lots of sites that I never use. Don't go with the free website just because you already created an account. Yes have a blog, but host it yourself. Again WordPress itself is free and quite easy to install. The domain and hosting will cost about $100/year. Set up WordPress on your own domain with your own hosting. You'll get more benefit from a blog that way than you will on a free site that someone else hosts.

dynocat
09-29-2009, 09:24 PM
Welcome corcor!

We handcraft and sell products. In 1998 I hired someone to set up a local designer website for me. After paying her several months with next to nothing to show for it, I signed up and built my own. I later learned her background was in hair design! :)

I knew nothing about web sites and learned a lot from forums like this, html informational sites and books.

I already owned the domain and agree that is your first step. Not sure if we can mention domain resellers here, but the one I use is very popular and easy to manage. Once thing to watch out for with some free hosts is that your site URL will be "mysite.freehost.com. It's better to have your own domain name so when you move up from the free host, your current customers can find you.

In my case the free hosting worked, but this was back in the day there weren't any options. They started charging a monthly fee at one point and a few years later went belly up.

If you're thinking of selling online there are quite a few inexpensive ecommerce hosts where you can set up info pages using premade templates along with a shopping cart for processing orders. I'm not sure I see the advantage of setting up an info only site if you have products ready to sell. I could be way off with that though.

Best of luck.

Harold Mansfield
09-29-2009, 11:36 PM
Let me just chime in and confirm that you should stay away from free sites...while you are building it, you will waste a lot of time and effort because they give off a lack of professionalism because they are usually free for a reason...mainly, they will advertise on your site, or limit what you are able to do.

I also agree that WP is your best option with limited or no skills and as you learn you can continue to make the site better, change the design , even have one custome designed when you have the funds and you won't lose ground and have to go through switching the site to a new host (from the free one).

There are also other things that you can do to gather some eyes on your craft such as joining social networks and seeking out others that are interested in the same, or similar things. You can do this for free.

Off the top of my head (since I like working with Facebook) is to start a FB froup, or fan page..grab yourself a keyword there and start a little group of your own...as you look around for other gardening, home improvement or like forums to offer help on your expertise, you can draw people into joining you on those Social Networking forums and your blog.

It's tough going with no skills in any kind of web design or applications, but it can be done. Just remember there was a point in all of our lives when we didn't know much either, mostly because these things didn't exist (talking to you old timers).

The one thing to remember, even with no skills and learning everything from scratch, one of the most important things that you can do for yourself is to have good images...good images can make a $10 theme look like a million bucks with the right placement and minor customizations and you will also be able to use them on your other web marketing attempts like a facebook page.

Also , don't limit yourself to just the actual trees..trees need pots, care items, pruning equipment and everything else that you can also sell via an affiliate program like Amazon.

If you have a decent digital and/or video camera, you can be on your way PDQ. I assume you know alot about care, pruning and everything else involved with caring for Bonzai trees, and you can make instructional videos relatively easy with a little basic instruction from free ebooks or blogs, and use any free editing software like what comes with your computer.

There are a ton of things that you can do that don't cost a dime, you just have to learn and ask questions, but, the one thing that I don't think you can skimp on is a decent domain and your own hosting.

KristineS
09-30-2009, 09:49 AM
I'm with the rest who have said get your own domain and your own hosting. I'll give you an example of why that's important.

A few years back I started an organization for people who blog about the outdoors. Since the organization was non profit, we started with a Blogger blog just to see if the idea would fly. We got a reasonable number of members, and a nice amount of growth, but it wasn't going gangbusters.

This year, I (or rather Vangogh, who did the work) moved the site to its own domain and it became a WordPress blog. Just doing that relatively small thing gave the organization a whole new legitimacy and membership has doubled.

Perception is part of sales. Free sites and blogs don't seem as legitimate or professional. If you want to sell online and hope to build a business, you need to look as professional and legitimate as you possibly can. A free site isn't going to help you do that.

corcor67
10-01-2009, 02:05 PM
thatks everyone, i have taken up some reading on all the:
<html>
<head>
</head>
<body>
</body>
</html>

im a hands ok kinda guy, i fix my cars, house, etc... its a bit hard for me to grasp all this telling the browser how to display a page, what goes where kinda stuff, but I'll learn it...it will be a while untill my product is ready for the market, but Im working with the goal of getting it out there asap, I want to make sure I will understand my website even if i don't build it, then when i have a problem I don't have to wait for someone else to fix it...Thanks for all the great advice, I'm sure I'll have more questions to come, and I know just where to get the answers ;)

vangogh
10-01-2009, 11:33 PM
Being hands on with this stuff is the best way to learn it. You have the basic html structure set. Now start adding things to it and see what happens.

Paper Shredder Clay
10-02-2009, 11:48 AM
I respect your approach, I am a hands on person. In fact, I taught myself web designing and developing and then went back to school for that paper to show I know my stuff. If you are going to sell products on your site you should definitely be sure you understand security before you try to take on a shopping cart or check out Paypal. And if its going to be a shopping site or even a non-shopping catalog site you should explore PHP, MySQL or ASP to create database so you don't have to code each page, which can be very labor intensive on a huge site.

KristineS
10-02-2009, 01:41 PM
Definitely a good idea to know how all this works even if you don't choose to do it yourself. I often don't choose to build my sites or fix problems (ask Vangogh!) but I generally understand what's causing the problem or how to fix it, or at least have a enough knowledge to be able to puzzle it out. Trusting someone to manage and build your sites is fine, but you should understand enough to know that they're doing it well and correctly.