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Paul
05-11-2018, 01:10 AM
Sorry I'm tagging on to this thread but my question doesn't really need its own.

I just became involved with a start up that needs to basically duplicate an existing site with just a few edits, mainly contact information. The company contracted the US rights to distribute medical supplies from a European manufacturer. The manufacturers site is perfect but just needs the contact info and the name changed along with a few slight edits. (some words are misspelled from it being translated from Spanish). Anyway the question is what should this cost? How simple is it.We have the manufacturers permission and cooperation. Can they transfer a file to us? sorry I'm so technically challenged, I just don't want to over pay. The manufacturers site is Eurobastón (http://www.Eurobaston.com) or Eurobastonusa.com.

Harold Mansfield
05-11-2018, 12:20 PM
Sorry I'm tagging on to this thread but my question doesn't really need its own.

I just became involved with a start up that needs to basically duplicate an existing site with just a few edits, mainly contact information. The company contracted the US rights to distribute medical supplies from a European manufacturer. The manufacturers site is perfect but just needs the contact info and the name changed along with a few slight edits. (some words are misspelled from it being translated from Spanish). Anyway the question is what should this cost? How simple is it.We have the manufacturers permission and cooperation. Can they transfer a file to us? sorry I'm so technically challenged, I just don't want to over pay. The manufacturers site is Eurobastón (http://www.Eurobaston.com) or Eurobastonusa.com.

I did move this because it was worthy of it's own thread.

I wouldn't be able to tell you what it "should" cost. It depends. There is no chart of rates that applies from one service provider to the next since not everyone has the same expertise. The first thing you need to know is who you need to hire. What skills do they need to have based on what you need to do.


it's not exactly as easy as transferring a file. A website is comprised of dozens, hundreds, or thousands of files and usually some sort of database. However, depending on how it's built, you CAN generally download all of the files (and the database) that make up the site. Making it all work again on a new server is not always easy,.

Some variables to consider before hiring someone to make sure you're hiring the right person.

1. "Duplicating" a site can be far more work than just moving the existing site to a new server or new URL. Duplicating is basically rebuilding it. Moving it is keeping it as is and just hosting it somewhere new. Like moving a mobile home on a flatbed, rather than taking it apart and rebuilding it on a new lot.

Moving takes less time than rebuilding as long as you are moving to the exact same hosting environment.

For instance, if the site was built on a Windows server and you need to "Duplicate" it on a Linux server, that's going to surely be a quagmire that triggers one problem after another and many things will have to be reconfigured or rebuilt. In that case it's much easier to scrap the Linux environment and recreate the Windows one..if that is an option.

Sometimes both environments can be the same software, but different versions and the site won't run on updated versions. I run into this problem with old WordPress sites that have custom plug ins built that will not work on updated/current versions of PHP. It's a pain in the ass. Many times they have to either continue using the old version of PHP (which I don't recommend) or find a new solution to handle that function.

In your scenario it sounds like you're not taking over the site, you're just recreating one just like it. If that's true, then find out everything about it's current hosting environment especially what version of all needed software (and database) they are running, and recreate it. That should make it easier for someone to get the files and rebuild it on your own server.

Something to also look out for are things or functions on the current website that is driven by other servers, or populating information from some kind of external database, like a collection of You Tube videos, or in the case of Realtors MLS listings. It that's an issue you need to know that and have a plan for how to either compensate, replace it with your own ( as in the case of licensed software or API's), or find out if you're also gaining access to that as well.


2. Unless your website will be blocking visitors from the EU, you will need to update to comply with GDPR. The EU's General Protection Privacy Regulation which goes into effect May 26, 2018. If so, depending on what customer information is stored through the website, you will need to update your website/database security to comply with the law and allow customers full access to their data.

You may want to ask the current site owners how they're handling it, what changes they've made to comply, and see if it's all part of what they're allowing you to duplicate. That will save you some dough.


Hope I didn't make that more confusing.

gimli
05-11-2018, 12:51 PM
This is here a good coder comes in, as mentioned above much of the move will depend on what it was designed on and how modular the code is. Good programmers always write with change in mind bad ones dont that could make a move an absolute nightmare for you. Ive known many a company who were set on migration untl they ran into the code that was just easier to re write the entire site.

First thing i would ensure that i get all the content its so easy to skip or miss something , checking comparability of your current host to their host ,as example above the php version.
You are going to need somebody for seo, there are alot of seo issues that come along with site changes especially of the old oe is still up, you will need a bakend and front end developer.

I have done one or two of these before some went good and some went bad, the best thing to do is plan plan plan. Check your compatibility, set up a migration team, pln for a slight loss i traffic as the site indexes and has to get out of sandbox, talk to your seo guy about duplicate content issues, look for code that isnt modular urls that are absolute and not relative. Use search console's tools to inspect any issues from the front end. Your logs on your server should give you and idea of any back end issues, and Databases should be combed through and through.

Also make sure you are withing legal rights as Harold advised.

As for price some people will do a good job for cheap , some will do a rubbish job for alot of money, Always do some background checks on who you are working with.

Paul
05-11-2018, 03:12 PM
I did move this because it was worthy of it's own thread.

I wouldn't be able to tell you what it "should" cost. It depends. There is no chart of rates that applies from one service provider to the next since not everyone has the same expertise. The first thing you need to know is who you need to hire. What skills do they need to have based on what you need to do.


it's not exactly as easy as transferring a file. A website is comprised of dozens, hundreds, or thousands of files and usually some sort of database. However, depending on how it's built, you CAN generally download all of the files (and the database) that make up the site. Making it all work again on a new server is not always easy,.

Some variables to consider before hiring someone to make sure you're hiring the right person.

1. "Duplicating" a site can be far more work than just moving the existing site to a new server or new URL. Duplicating is basically rebuilding it. Moving it is keeping it as is and just hosting it somewhere new. Like moving a mobile home on a flatbed, rather than taking it apart and rebuilding it on a new lot.

Moving takes less time than rebuilding as long as you are moving to the exact same hosting environment.

For instance, if the site was built on a Windows server and you need to "Duplicate" it on a Linux server, that's going to surely be a quagmire that triggers one problem after another and many things will have to be reconfigured or rebuilt. In that case it's much easier to scrap the Linux environment and recreate the Windows one..if that is an option.

Sometimes both environments can be the same software, but different versions and the site won't run on updated versions. I run into this problem with old WordPress sites that have custom plug ins built that will not work on updated/current versions of PHP. It's a pain in the ass. Many times they have to either continue using the old version of PHP (which I don't recommend) or find a new solution to handle that function.

In your scenario it sounds like you're not taking over the site, you're just recreating one just like it. If that's true, then find out everything about it's current hosting environment especially what version of all needed software (and database) they are running, and recreate it. That should make it easier for someone to get the files and rebuild it on your own server.

Something to also look out for are things on the current website that are driven by other servers. An easy example of this is populating information from some kind of database, like a collection of You Tube videos, or in the case of Realtors MLS listings. It that's an issue, you need to know that and have a plan for how to either compensate, replace it with your own, or find out if you're also gaining access to that as well.

2. Unless your website will be blocking visitors from the EU, you will need to update to comply with GDPR. The EU's General Protection Privacy Regulation which goes into effect May 26, 2018. If so, depending on what customer information is stored through the website, you will need to update your website/database security to comply with the law and allow customers full access to their data.

You may want to ask the current site owners how they're handling it, what changes they've made to comply, and see if it's all part of what they're allowing you to duplicate. That will save you some dough.


Hope I didn't make that more confusing.

Thanks all for the feedback. More complicated than I thought. I was hoping for "cut and paste" kind of solution. Anyway, with all that I now learned I will probably just ask the manufacturer to have his web guys do it. Should be easy for them I assume.

Harold Mansfield
05-11-2018, 04:19 PM
Thanks all for the feedback. More complicated than I thought. I was hoping for "cut and paste" kind of solution. Anyway, with all that I now learned I will probably just ask the manufacturer to have his web guys do it. Should be easy for them I assume.
Whenever possible, deferring to the people who built the original is definitely the way to go.

Harold Mansfield
05-11-2018, 06:32 PM
I also just noticed that this is a WordPress site. That makes things significantly easier.
Here's what you're working with:

WordPress 4.9 - A few updates back, but shouldn't be a big deal.

Premium plug ins that you may need your own license for:
Slider Revolution - about $25
Visual Composer - About $30

The theme may be a custom version of an existing theme, so it may also require a license if you want to continue getting any updates.($??)

This should be a relatively routine job for someone. Maybe a few hours depending on how easy it is to get everything that they need from the source (complete), and how quick you are setting up new hosting and giving them access to it and whatever domain you're using.

Get the files (download the full installation from the other guys), export the database, set up your own Linux hosting, point the domain, move the site, change the URL in the database, and add yourself as an admin. (not necessarily in that order).

After that besides just changing the contact info and updating the SEO, you will also want to go through the site and remove all mentions, links, and connections to the other site and of course verify your own version with your own Google and other webmaster tools accounts. And reconfigure any plug ins with your own licenses and information as needed.

You will still have to wait the normal time for DNS change, but it's not as hard as it would be if it were built another way or a completely custom coded site dependent on a custom environment.

turboguy
05-11-2018, 07:47 PM
Harold is right it is a wordpress site and they are using the Imprezza theme by Upsolution

The plugins they are using are

Contact form 7
Slider Revolution
WP bakery page builder
Site Origin widget bundle

Paul
05-13-2018, 07:51 PM
Thanks for that info Harold and Turbo. So, I gather that anyone familiar with wordpress should be able to do this. Thanks again, this will save me from being totally bamboozled. That , of course is the fear of every non-tech when it involves hiring for web work.

Harold Mansfield
05-13-2018, 08:19 PM
Thanks for that info Harold and Turbo. So, I gather that anyone familiar with wordpress should be able to do this.
Not just a WordPress web designer. Specifically someone experienced in moving WordPress sites who can also troubleshoot configuration issues. But yes, anyone worth their salt in WordPress should be able to do this without much trouble.

gimli
07-07-2018, 03:13 AM
why would one need site origin and wp bakery ? they both page builders is this the way the developers made it? I know that as good as wp bakery is is quite slow, site origin is alot faster but with less features although if you know what you are doing you can get away with most site building issues with some clever template editing. Just weird they would have a combo of these two plugins?

turboguy
07-07-2018, 06:37 AM
Yes, those are the plugins that were used to build the existing site. There are a lot of plugins that do basically the same thing and I am sure if someone has enough skills they could use fewer plugins but most wordpress sites use 6-12 plugins since it is much quicker and easier to just install a plugin to do what you want.

Harold Mansfield
07-07-2018, 10:48 AM
why would one need site origin and wp bakery ? they both page builders is this the way the developers made it? I know that as good as wp bakery is is quite slow, site origin is alot faster but with less features although if you know what you are doing you can get away with most site building issues with some clever template editing. Just weird they would have a combo of these two plugins?
Yeah that is redundant, but more common than you think. Many DIY'ers and WordPress "designers" use plug ins to compensate for not knowing how to do it any other way or to save time and do the project on the cheap.

turboguy
07-07-2018, 10:59 AM
I have used SiteOrigin's page builder but have never used wp bakery. They do seem like two plugins which do much the same thing and using both doesn't seem to make much sense.

jeffscott
07-18-2018, 04:07 AM
Aside from professional developers you will need the help from the website analyst or SEO in which will guide the programmers for what will be the effect of their process.

gimli
08-06-2018, 03:36 AM
Yes, those are the plugins that were used to build the existing site. There are a lot of plugins that do basically the same thing and I am sure if someone has enough skills they could use fewer plugins but most wordpress sites use 6-12 plugins since it is much quicker and easier to just install a plugin to do what you want.

This is why most WordPress sites are slow and the general WordPress community spend most of their time looking for speed plugins. Every plugin you use has its own javascript and css files creating mre external http request and also causing render blocking. Whilst i agree you can get away with a few plugins 12 , 10 is way too much. I understand that not every webmaster can code what all plugins do, myself included but i find it ironic that most webmaster would install another plugin to alleviate the problem of plugins. Even cache plugins cause render blocking. The only way around this is to combine you scc and js files which in my experience almost always case conflict especially js. Or use a cdn or virtual private serer that allows for keep alive connections.

Harold Mansfield
08-06-2018, 11:55 AM
This is why most WordPress sites are slow and the general WordPress community spend most of their time looking for speed plugins.

I have to disagree a bit. These days old WordPress sites are slow, or those that no one is maintaining. Core WordPress is actually pretty snappy these days. It's inexperienced admins who screw it up with a bunch of junk.


...but i find it ironic that most webmaster would install another plugin to alleviate the problem of plugins. Even cache plugins cause render blocking. The only way around this is to combine you scc and js files which in my experience almost always case conflict especially js. Or use a cdn or virtual private serer that allows for keep alive connections.

Actually many consumer level hosts recommend using a cache plug in. I deal with various hosting companies throughout the month, and most of my clients have shared of VPS hosting. Just about every host I deal with recommends one cache plug in or another as having best results for working with their servers.

But overall I do agree. A lot of people use plugins to make up for not having any basic HTML or CSS skills. It's also common for me to log into dashboards and see a graveyard of plug ins running that haven't been updated in 2 years, running old frameworks, running plugins for things that WordPress now does naturally and so on.