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rezzy
04-06-2009, 10:09 AM
Hello all,

This is a general question I have. Including anyway of marketing, from websites, to social media, to online/offline ads, referrals, what is the most effective way to market?

Which way do you market that gives the most bang for your buck?

Dan Furman
04-06-2009, 11:08 AM
You will get a million different answers. But for me, it's simple:

A good website, combined with an aggressive adwords program, does the trick.

rezzy
04-06-2009, 11:19 AM
You will get a million different answers

Thats kinda what I was looking for. I was looking to figure out what are the most cost effective vs. expensive less return methods.

I have seen people trying post cards, pens etc, but wondered how effective they were. Or does Adword advertising actually work.

I have a client that could use some marketing advice, and I was trying to gather some ideas, to get a get return on investment.

vangogh
04-06-2009, 11:27 AM
There is no one most effective way to market. I think you have to look at your business model and your own skills and personality when you're a small business. To me the whole concept of marketing boils down to a few things. You need to find communities that have interest in what you're offering. You want to figure out where that community spends its time and then build a presence there. You should be doing what you can to build your brand with that community and naturally be able to deliver on your brand promise.

Your business is obviously similar to mine. Start with your own site and services and think about what it is that you can really offer. What is it about you that differentiates you from all the others offering the same services. Think too about who would be interested in hiring you. It's easy to think that anyone who wants a website is your market, but that's too general. Look for specific groups within everyone who wants a website that would be more likely to hire you and think about where those people might spend their times. If many of them read the same magazine it makes sense to have an ad in that magazine. If many of them spend time on one or two social sites you should also spend time on those social sites.

One thing to consider is that given the nature of your business you don't need a lot of clients. A few dozen and you'll be doing well. So you don't have to think of it as a numbers game in the sense of needing more and more traffic. 10,000 visitors a day isn't really your goal. Better to get a few hundred people to your site that are honestly interested in your services and convincing a few of them to contact you. If you picked up one client a month for the next year you'll likely be doing well.

At the moment what you need is more content on your site. Your site doesn't have enough info to convince people to hire you and so your efforts now toward bringing people to the site isn't going to result in anything meaningful. As your building out your site more think about what you can offer that others can't and try to keep that in mind on every page you create for your site. Don't worry if you don't get it entirely right at first. Do your best to understand what differentiates yourself and reevaluate it over time.

While you're building the site more you can look into many of the sites that have projects for freelancers. When I first started I spent time looking at the ads on Craig's List. Most of them were garbage, but here and there I'd find one or two to respond to. I picked up 2 lowing paying jobs from the site in those early months. One led to a small payment and a site for my portfolio. One led to no money (we worked out a trade), but a contact who has sent me more business over the years.

Keep looking for ways you can connect with people. For example you offer application development. Many web designers don't. One market for you could then be web designers who need programming. Even more specific might be WordPress theme designers. If you can write a few plugins and offer them freely on your site, you'll pick up traffic from people wanting the plugins and build a brand around the idea that you're an application developer for WordPress. In time people will contact you to create custom plugins for a site or help them customize a free plugin. Next thing you know that same person will be asking you for more development work.

Steve B
04-06-2009, 11:31 AM
It totally depends on what kind of business you have. I'll assume you want answers that apply to a website design business - so my answers wouldn't apply.

cocoy
04-06-2009, 11:57 AM
Yeah I think it depends on the type of business.

My clients find me mainly through referrals and some through direct mail.

My recent new client she said she received my flyer over 3 months ago. She hung on to it even though she already had a different person doing her work. Just last week she found out her guy moved away from the area, so she called me.

Dan Furman
04-06-2009, 12:26 PM
Or does Adword advertising actually work.


Yes, it does, but here's the caveat: You have to spend $$ on it. Both in the ads themselves, and perhaps on your own site.

For an ad itself, if you aren't landing on the first page, the effectiveness goes WAY down. For some industries (like yours and mine), it's not cheap. So that's step one - pay enough per click to get on page 1.

Then, your ad has to get people to click it. Test, test, test.

Lastly, your site has to convert those clicks. Harder than it sounds. If you are getting 100 qualified people to your site, and nobody is contacting you for business, your site isn't good enough.

Work backwards here - make the site a converting machine first. Then buy ads for it.

KristineS
04-06-2009, 12:38 PM
I'll have to agree with everyone who's said the best form of marketing depends on what the business is and the industry it's in. One of our companies has had success with blogging and contributing to forums. Another company operates in a completely different industry and there aren't any forums or blogs to be found. You have to adapt to the environment.

The biggest thing is knowing where your customers are and being there as well.

vangogh
04-06-2009, 12:42 PM
Just want to echo what Dan said. AdWords works for him, but there are a few caveats. First he has a site that can convert visitors to clients. Without that no amount of traffic would be meaningful. Second, while I haven't seen the specific ads Dan has written, I'm sure they are well written and effective and generating clicks. And third I'm sure Dan has figured out how much money he can spend on ads to still be profitable based on how well his site converts.

And yes work backwards. You have to have a site than can convert before any advertising is going to really work.

One more thing to add. I've never used AdWords at all for my business. It's not that I think it can't work. I think it can. But I've been able to attract clients in other ways without having to spend on the clicks. Doesn't mean I won't use AdWords in the future. I probably will. All it means is there are many different ways to market your business successfully. Don't look for the way to market your business. There is no one single way.

rezzy
04-06-2009, 01:48 PM
I agree that in most cases marketing techniques are specfic to your industry. I think there is something to be learned from others, because we all want the same things, customers to purchase our products/services. There are some marketing techniques that fail, no matter what market you are in. IMHO.

For instance: Has anyone tried direct mailings? Or email spamming? Or cold calling?

Have these methods worked? Or do you get more hangups then contacts?

vangogh
04-06-2009, 02:08 PM
Of the three I would never send out email spam. I tried cold calling in the beginning, but I don't care for it. I don't like receiving calls like that so I didn't want to be someone making the call. I also think the ROI is extremely low. I only did one direct mailing. Again I think it's something with a low ROI and more of my clients are going to be found online as opposed to offline. However of the three that's the only one I would consider for the future. Direct mailing can be done effectively.


There are some marketing techniques that fail, no matter what market you are in.

I disagree and it's really my point here. It depends on your business and it depends on your skills. For example cold calls felt wrong to me. I don't like getting them so why would I want to call others. I also think trust is a big factor in hiring a web designer and I don't think a relationship that starts with a cold call is one built on trust.

Others might have great success with cold calling. A one time sale of a product maybe or perhaps someone who doesn't have the same feelings as I do about cold calling in general.

That's why I say there is no one way of marketing that is best. You have to figure out what works best for you. The way to do that is try a bunch of different things that fit with your business model, give them an honest attempt, and see what works best. By an honest attempt I mean you have to really try. If you want to participate in direct mailing you need to consistently send out mailers for a few months. If you send one postcard and quit you haven't given it an honest attempt.

cbscreative
04-06-2009, 03:39 PM
I'll mention this one only because no one else has yet, but then add a disclaimer. Articles can be effective, though because of a lot of abuse, it can be challenging to get established.

This method should be used like vangogh indicated above with getting in places where your target market will see you. A great example would be a trade magazine or site. If you were to get published, it builds a lot of credibility, and it's far more powerful than being one of a zillion authors on an article site.

rezzy
04-06-2009, 04:00 PM
as i am reading this, i should have made a better title. how do you market your service/ product.

i really wanted to see how people marketed their services. as a way of developing and finding new methods.

vangogh
04-06-2009, 04:25 PM
Steve good call on the article marketing.

Bryan I'll change the title of the thread after I finish this post. Most of my marketing has been in the way of branding. I look to brand myself as a designer/seo to various communities. This forum is one of those communities. I don't actively promote myself, but in answering questions and helping where I can people know what I do and they can see what I can do. I do similar through social media, though there it's more submitting what I think is useful content or networking through Twitter. My goal is always to add something into the community rather than trying to extract something from it.

Early on I routinely looked at sites like Craig's List to see if there were projects out there I could do. I can't say I had a lot of success with CL directly, but it did lead to at least one connection that has since paid off.

I also joined a couple of local Chambers of Commerce. Not much happened there, but I did pick up one client who wanted to support of member of the Chamber.

Much of my marketing is word of mouth. I do my best with every client and try to give them more than they expect. For the most part that's lead to my clients recommending me to others. It didn't happen overnight, but over time one client leads to the next which leads to the next.

I've had clients find me through search engines. I've had clients find me through my blog.

I can't necessarily say one method has been any better than the others. Mostly I look for where potential clients might be and try to spend some time there, again adding to the community instead of extracting from it. Build connections with real people. It takes time, but eventually it pays off. As more people know what you can do and what services you offer the odds of one of them recommending you goes up. Treat each client well and more people will recommend you.

cocoy
04-06-2009, 04:33 PM
Have you tried elance or guru?

rezzy
04-06-2009, 05:35 PM
Have you tried elance or guru?

I have looked at similar sites, but think its overly competitve. People under cut their pricing to win. I think its the wrong type of market.

People generally give canned messages and I just think thats not that way I want to do business.

Has anyone ever tried leaving flyers on cars? When ever I find them on my car, i glance at them and throw them in the nearest trash can.

vangogh
04-06-2009, 06:26 PM
Those site are overly competitive, but some people have success with them. If you're looking to build a portfolio and generate some initial clients it may not be the worst idea to go low with pricing for a job or two. I wouldn't suggest doing that for long, but you can justify the lower price to an extent.

I think for most business flyers on cars are completely useless. The only ones I can see having even a chance of success is if the business is related to cars or if it's a store in the same shopping center. Say a sub shop that puts a coupon on the flyer.

cbscreative
04-06-2009, 11:49 PM
Although sites like elance may work for some, I would agree that it is mostly bad for both parties. I've used this analogy before, but I think posting a project on sites like this is like throwing a piece of meat into a cage of hungry wolves. I'm sure many people have had good experiences, but I suspect most have not.

As a client, you are not likely going to get a good selection of potential vendors because experienced people would probably not use this method of getting work. As a service provider, why would anyone want to participate in this feeding frenzy?

I think the model is fundamentally flawed. If you compare to eBay, the highest bidder gets the goods. These sites generally favor the lowest bidder, therefore robbing the incentive for quality work and turning things upside down.

phanio
04-07-2009, 09:28 AM
Marketing is not about what channel you chose. It is about your customer. Do you know your customer - their needs and their habits. If you are selling hearing aids - your target market may not be looking for information online - thus adwords may not work. If you are selling webdesign - then adwords may work. It is about your customers. If you understand your customers needs - you can taylor your marketing message to that need. If you know your customer's habits - then you can chose the right channel for your message.

Think about this example - Men's Underwear. If you pick up a package of men's underwear - you will see a very fit (and I assume sexy) male model on the package. As a male - that does not appeal to me - but, the makers of these products know that 90% or more of their products are bought by women (wives and girlfriends) - thus the message is geared towards them.

As a side note, marketing only generates interest in you and your products - you must also have sales proceedures in place - thus, once you get a customer interested - your sales proceddures will ensure they buy.

Example, a few years ago a Pet Smart moved into our neighborhood. They blasted all media channels about their products and services. My wife and I were interested and visited the store. We walked around but had a hard time finding the items we were looking for. Moreover, we could not find anyone to ask where the products were. After some time - we found a few things we wanted to buy, but when we got to the check out lines - there was only one open and the line for it was long. We ended up walking out of the store without buying anything. The thing here is that they got us interested - but could not close the deal. There channel was right but they still got no bang for their buck.

Bottom line - know your customer - know all that you can about them - create a message that addresses their needs - then find the channel that will target them the best.

vangogh
04-07-2009, 12:05 PM
Bottom line - know your customer - know all that you can about them - create a message that addresses their needs - then find the channel that will target them the best.

That's basically how I see it too. I'll differ a bit, though it's really just semantics. I'd say there is no channel that's best. One my work best for one customer and another channel may work best for another customer. I'd also say that some of us will naturally do better in some channels than others. I think you have to look for as many possible channels that you can that work for both your customers and you.

Great Pet Smart story. The online equivalent is getting a lot of traffic to your site, but having a site that completely underperforms.

KristineS
04-07-2009, 12:37 PM
As a side note, marketing only generates interest in you and your products - you must also have sales proceedures in place - thus, once you get a customer interested - your sales proceddures will ensure they buy.

Example, a few years ago a Pet Smart moved into our neighborhood. They blasted all media channels about their products and services. My wife and I were interested and visited the store. We walked around but had a hard time finding the items we were looking for. Moreover, we could not find anyone to ask where the products were. After some time - we found a few things we wanted to buy, but when we got to the check out lines - there was only one open and the line for it was long. We ended up walking out of the store without buying anything. The thing here is that they got us interested - but could not close the deal. There channel was right but they still got no bang for their buck.

Bottom line - know your customer - know all that you can about them - create a message that addresses their needs - then find the channel that will target them the best.

That Pet Smart story is so on the money. Half the battle is getting the customer to want to do business with you, the other half is to keep them doing business with you. Make sure you spend as much time planning how you'll deliver what you promised as you do making promises.

cocoy
04-07-2009, 04:55 PM
Those site are overly competitive, but some people have success with them. If you're looking to build a portfolio and generate some initial clients it may not be the worst idea to go low with pricing for a job or two. I wouldn't suggest doing that for long, but you can justify the lower price to an extent.

I set up an account there. I only bid on one job just because the employer was in my city. Figured it's free advertising. :)
I'm not expecting to get any projects when there are people in India charging 7-8 bucks an hour.

vangogh
04-07-2009, 05:34 PM
It's hard to compete with them I know. I never opened an account with any of those sites, but I've heard enough people claiming success I figure it's worth a shot. Shouldn't take long to find out if it can work Craig's List was as close a I came to the freelance sites, which wasn't a great source of jobs for me, but did provide a few useful jobs in the end.

huggytree
04-07-2009, 08:16 PM
networking & direct mailers

without networking id be out of business. i get 1/3rd of my business from networking

phone book gets me $5k a year in business
website gets me $500 a year

cbscreative
04-07-2009, 09:09 PM
phone book gets me $5k a year in business
website gets me $500 a year

I'd be a little careful when trusting the measuring stick too much on something like this, and here's why I say this. Suppose your lead starts with the phone book, and then looks you up online. You could easily credit the phone book, but the web site may have helped too (whether it gets credit for it or not).

Just like the points were made above about all the methods working together, I believe that is shown to be true in many cases. It seems to me this principle gets missed very easily.

I've regularly heard business owners questioning themselves and others about how much business a web site brings in. I think this is very difficult to measure unless you are doing strictly ecommerce. Business owners often assume that unless the inquiry comes from email or a contact form, or the customer explicitly mentions their site, that the web site did not influence the sale.

Even word of mouth referrals are likely to use a web site, so having one is a must for most businesses. You should have a noticeable increase in business from a web site, I just have trouble trusting stat numbers based on assumptions.

rezzy
04-07-2009, 11:54 PM
Steve, I agree with you. Whenever I am researching something, the first place I run is their website.

If they dont have one, its a nick off them. For instance, I recently went apartment shopping, if the complex didnt have a website, I figured they didnt expend the time and energy, and money to buy a domain and throw some pictures together, then it wasnt worth me driving there and meeting them.

vangogh
04-08-2009, 01:30 AM
huggy my guess is a business like yours still does more business offline than online, however I'm still going to agree with Steve and Bryan. Admittedly I'm on the higher end of the tech savvy, but I couldn't even tell you the last time I opened a phone book. A month or so ago I needed an electrician so I looked online and found one and he did a great job.

I don't really know how you promote your site, but based solely on what I see on this forum I'd suspect you don't. Where's your signature link for example. True most of us aren't in your area, but the links in your sig begin to help with search engines. If you don't take advantage of the free link here I'd assume you don't take advantage of it in other places.

Have you spent the few minutes it takes to list your business and site with Google Maps? Yahoo Maps? MSN Maps? You were talking about surveys in another thread. Ever thought of asking your customers to review your business on any of the mapping sites after you list with them.

You need to promote your site for people to know about it. Maybe you do. I don't really know.

As far as $5k and $500 numbers how are you tracking that? Do you assume if someone calls they came from the phone book? Are you asking them? Do you have a coupon in the phone book for people to use? Lot's of retailers are finding that people who shop in their stores spent time on the website gathering info before making a purchase. Truth is it's getting harder to know exactly what contributes to a sale. Everything you do works together to create a sale.

Is the $5k and $500 after expenses? How much does the phone book charge you annually for an ad? Now that your site is done it should cost a little less than $100/year to host.

cocoy
04-08-2009, 12:23 PM
As a homeowner if I need a plumber I'd probably ask a neighbor for a referral. Now...where that neighbor got the plumbers name is another issue. It may have been a referral also or maybe he just went in the phone book. :confused:

I always ask a new client where they got my number/info. Most time they just end up saying it anyway.

"I was referred to you by Bob..."

"I just got your flier..."

cocoy
04-08-2009, 12:25 PM
Just wanted to add.

Many of my neighbors are senior citizens and I know for sure that they use a phone book if they need a service when they don't know who to call.

vangogh
04-08-2009, 01:08 PM
No question there are still people using the phone book. I wouldn't suggest huggy have his listing removed. But it's also clear that the number of people using the phone book as their first source is going down and those using the internet as their first source is going up.

Even if people do go to the phone book first, many still then check online. There's very little info in the phone book even with a full page ad.

cocoy
04-08-2009, 01:36 PM
Oh. It wasn't directed at you.

I just think huggy has more business coming from the phone book than he may think.

huggytree
04-08-2009, 08:29 PM
you definately have to have a website...I know people use it...when i do a bid i always suggest they check it out...its a sales tool....not a job creator...

im #1 on google and yahoo....any combination of Plumber & Waukesha and my name is on the first page...usually 1,2,or 3 position....its the whole reason i chose my name...i wanted people to be able to find me and use me....its just been very dissapointing..

i ask every new customer where they got my name...i keep track of everything!

getting a new 'cold call' customer is rare...couple of times a month at best....i have another plumbing friend and he also says 2 per month new...all my business is referral and contractors.....

i had a phone book call me again today....they always say 'spend more and youll get tons of calls'....tons of price shoppers is my reply...

does anyone know the return on a full page ad in the phone book? would i get 20 calls a day?...i cant imagine it would pay for itself at $1000 + per month....my guess is id get 1-2 calls a day instead of 1 a month.

lately im considering taking my name out of all but one of the phonebooks....and putting that money into a 1/2 page BW ad....any thoughts?

Blessed
04-08-2009, 08:49 PM
My best marketing has been networking. I get most of my new work from referrals current customers have given their friends. Of course in my business, Graphic Design, that makes sense.

When I sell advertising (which I do from time to time for various publications) I usually do that through cold calling - I do fairly well, but it certainly isn't my favorite pastime.

I've also grabbed a few jobs off of craigslist - my experience has been similar to VanGogh's, I've done a few low-paying, one time jobs but I have had one or two that have led to some consistent work.

Also I have an ad in the local monthly newspaper (I write an article each month in payment - that is a hobby thing/work on my writing thing for me) in the six month's I've had my business card sized ad in the paper I've taken 4 calls. No work yet, but I have gotten to talk to people and anytime I talk to someone there is a chance that I'll get to sell them my services.

vangogh
04-09-2009, 01:05 AM
Networking and providing the best customer service I can is best for me. Most of my clients seem happy to recommend me. That doesn't lead to a lot of new clients quickly, but over time my client list grows from the recommendations.

What I find though is the initial clients to start that word of mouth have come from many different sources. That's why I think it's a good idea to get yourself out there in as many channels as is realistic. Try different things and see what works for you. Put more effort into what works and less effort into what doesn't. And then try some different things.

Burn Creative
04-09-2009, 11:58 AM
I've tried the networking thing and have gotten exactly zero from it. The only thing that has worked for me is sending out mailers and e-mails.

vangogh
04-09-2009, 12:06 PM
How have you tried to network? If you mean joining networking groups then I wouldn't expect them to do much for your business. But if you mean building relationships with people inside and outside of your industry then they really should pay off.

Burn Creative
04-09-2009, 01:47 PM
Yeah, networking groups, chamber of commerce... Other than that I really don't know what to do as far as networking with people or businesses.

vangogh
04-09-2009, 02:26 PM
Networking groups can be hit or miss depending on who's in the group. The kind of networking I'm talking about is building real relationships with people. Take here for instance. We post and get to know each other. It doesn't take long before we start to know what each other do for a living. Some of us end up using other member's services or buy their products. Some maybe recommend us to their friends.

I don't network at all through the Chamber or similar groups. I tried it, but like you it didn't lead to anything. Where I network is online, through forums and other social communities. That has resulted in clients. It took time, but after awhile as people knew what services I offered and got to know me I have gotten clients and recommendations.

rezzy
04-09-2009, 04:01 PM
Social networking is a longer term but stronger bond if done correctly. If I never a product or service I would come to the forums first, because I "know" these people. If it doesnt exist here, someone knows someone that can help.

This same sort of thing exists in other social media, but it takes time to build relationships with people. If you dont talk and actively particpate, you are forgotten amongst the masses.

vangogh
04-09-2009, 04:57 PM
it takes time to build relationships with people.

I think this is where people go wrong a lot. They look for the quick traffic instead of the long lasting relationship. It's another thing where the more you put into it, the more you get back from it.

huggytree
04-09-2009, 06:38 PM
ive been in BNI for 1 1/2 years now...i did $45,000 in business in year 1 and im probably over $25,000 into the 2nd year...$5,000 in just the past 8 days...without it this year i wouldnt be making profit anymore.

my group has alot of different trades in it...30 people total....i get tips every other week....you have to give tips to get tips....when you give someone else a tip they feel they owe you and give one back...they try harder..

i belong to the chamber of commerce too...i get very little from it....i go to the events...not many people show up....i get enough to pay for the membership...i may not join that one again.

i belong to builder associations and go to events to network...

some networking events/groups are no good....but some are...it also depends on what your product is and your personality...if people like you they will work harder for you...if your cold and monotone maybe not so much....if your selling something hardly anyone needs vs a product everyone needs its going to make a difference..since im a plumber my customer could be anyone....most people arent so lucky

vangogh
04-09-2009, 11:00 PM
it also depends on what your product is and your personality

Good point. I know there are ways to go into a networking group to get more out of it. Some people will do well with most groups and some won't do well with any. A lot does come down to the group itself.

Makes sense about giving out the tips. You have to think of the group from both sides. If you're not helping others there why should they feel motivated to help you. Of course that's true with any kind of business relationship.

Patrysha
04-10-2009, 04:16 PM
I believe in the power of networking and being a part of the Chamber has meant substantial success (in my eyes) for my business. I am only 10 months in, but things are looking better every day.

The video conference yesterday went well, I posted about what I learned from that on my blog as well as how the power of networking worked to get me that gig in the first place! (I was live and viewed in about 10 or so locations through video conference in two provinces and 1 territory...pretty cool I think!)

The Chamber hasn't given me any direct business, but the relationships that have developed (which would have taken longer to make without the Chamber) have led to good business partnerships and transactions...

Just another point of view.

Everyone should try a bit of everything until they figure out what really works for their business.

Burn Creative
04-12-2009, 12:00 PM
Good point. I know there are ways to go into a networking group to get more out of it. Some people will do well with most groups and some won't do well with any. A lot does come down to the group itself.

Makes sense about giving out the tips. You have to think of the group from both sides. If you're not helping others there why should they feel motivated to help you. Of course that's true with any kind of business relationship.

That's pretty much what happened when I was in the networking group. I really don't know too many people at all so I did not have any leads to give to other members. One day the vice president of the group pulled me aside and told me that if I don't give anyone any business leads no one is going to give me any. So, I left and that was it for that.

As far as the chamber of commerce goes for both years I tried it, it was a complete bust. That's definitely a few hundred dollars and a lot of wasted time I would like to get back. On the other hand there was one web designer there that was raking it in like you would not believe from doing business with other members.

Dan Furman
04-12-2009, 11:47 PM
I'm not a big fan of those tip clubs - just seems cheesy to me. But that's just my .02 - I could see where some would value them.

The Chamber - that's another story. I don't see how getting to know the other businesspeople in your area can hurt. If you think of it just as "quick leads", yea, you won't get anything out of it. The biggest movers and shakers in your area are at the Chamber functions - getting to know people like that is a good thing.

In addition, I look at the chamber much like I look at this forum - truthfully, I'm not here looking for business. I'm here to learn, give advice, get to know some other professionals, and maybe enhance my professional reputation, etc.

Burn Creative
04-13-2009, 09:08 AM
I'm pretty sure the majority of member at the chamber of commerce are there to meet people and get more business. I was not expecting droves of clients from it quickly. But I certainly didn't expect to completely waste my time and money and not get a single project out of it in two years. That's certainly not worthwhile to me.

vangogh
04-13-2009, 11:06 AM
When I was in the Chamber the few meetings I went to did have a sense of people being there mostly looking for new business. Some I could tell were there to enjoy themselves and get to know others in the area.


not get a single project out of it in two years

That is discouraging and easy to justify not going back. Hard to know if it was your particular chamber or if there were different things you could have done along the way. I still think if you approach Chamber networking the way Dan describes above it should work. If you go in with the idea of adding to the group without trying to take something from it, the group eventually responds by giving to you.

Dan Furman
04-13-2009, 11:35 AM
I'm pretty sure the majority of member at the chamber of commerce are there to meet people and get more business. I was not expecting droves of clients from it quickly. But I certainly didn't expect to completely waste my time and money and not get a single project out of it in two years. That's certainly not worthwhile to me.

Those types of members come and go quick. While Chamber mixers are indeed a place to swap cards, etc, the Chamber really isn't a place to look for (or expect) leads. It's a place to make contacts and friends - and those will eventually turn into leads.

I don't go to all the functions, but I've gone to enough to start to "know" some people. I'm also a member of toastmasters, etc. Some of the same people. This can only help me, and I learn something along the way (plus, it gets me out of the house.)

It's almost certain that the most successful businesspeople in your area belong to the chamber. Think about that.

Patrysha
04-13-2009, 11:57 AM
I don't know how it is set up in your area, but around here the tone and style of the Chamber does have a lot to do with the attitude and passions of the leadership. Two years ago, I didn't want to go near the Chamber with a ten foot pole...the negativity of the "old boys network" was just too much for me.

Now, a new president and a mostly new directorship has changed the attitude and direction and it's a much more forward thinking and enjoyable organization to be involved with. And now I'm a director too...which works for me and my particular business because I want to be at the forefront and get covered in the local media for the work I'm doing with the Chamber (Promotions director...so right up my alley)

Burn Creative
04-13-2009, 12:05 PM
Those types of members come and go quick. While Chamber mixers are indeed a place to swap cards, etc, the Chamber really isn't a place to look for (or expect) leads. It's a place to make contacts and friends - and those will eventually turn into leads.

I don't go to all the functions, but I've gone to enough to start to "know" some people. I'm also a member of toastmasters, etc. Some of the same people. This can only help me, and I learn something along the way (plus, it gets me out of the house.)

It's almost certain that the most successful businesspeople in your area belong to the chamber. Think about that.

Hey, I tried it and it did not work for me so that's that. Everything can't work for everyone and the chamber of commerce sure didn't do anything for me.

Remipub
04-14-2009, 03:56 AM
To answer the original question: "Which way do you market that gives the most bang for your buck?" I think in almost any industry, referrals has to be the answer. Yes, other methods allow you to reach more people more quickly, but when you have a strong referral source, it constantly works for you behind the scenes while you go about your business - and it costs you nothing.

Of course the key to building business through referrals is giving a good product or service at a fair price. Now the term fair price is highly dependant on how good the product or service is ... for example a widget that costs $10 and has a 30 day warranty may not be considered as fairly priced as a $15 dollar widget with a lifetime warranty. It's not just about price - but about what your customers get for that price. That being said, the 'type' of referrals will be in direct correlation to your reputation. A high quality type provider will attract referrals from those seeking higher quality. Likewise, if you are known as the low price leader, people who seek that type of thing will refer you to others who seek the same. Now if you can offer the lowest prices AND high quality ... well then you're golden! (sorry - off on a tangent!)

The thing too about referral business - if your customers are thrilled with what you gave them, not only will they tell others, but they'll LOVE telling others. Even still, people are often buried in their own world and don't think to tell about a great product or service unless they're asked for a recommendation. With that in mind, don't be afraid to ask for referrals. Sometimes we just need to be reminded...