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Blessed
03-02-2009, 11:21 AM
I have a long-time customer who is generally a pain in the rear but who does get a fair amount of work at regular intervals and pays faster than any of the rest of my customers. I've been doing design work for her for about four years now.

She has a major project in May/June every year and then a bigger one in October/November. Occasionally she'll ask for a small job in between. At the beginning of January she needed one of those small jobs - It took about 30 minutes, my minimum charge is an hour. I sent her an un-watermarked proof and never heard another word from her. So I called to see what was going on and if the job was approved, etc... she indicated that she didn't think I should charge her for the job because it was a quick revision of one of her other forms. But then did mention that she wants her new logo that I made for her in the fall and she wants letterhead/envelopes designed. Then she had to hang up and I'm supposed to call her back today or tomorrow.

So... do I send an invoice even though I know it will make her mad, or do I simply roll the cost into the next job I do for her. (This would be very easy to do without her really noticing - it will be less than $100)? In the meantime - she definitely won't be getting the high-res file of her new logo and etc... until I get a check. Oh, and now I guess she gets watermarked proofs just like everyone else...

rezzy
03-02-2009, 11:44 AM
My thinking is to just let her have without charging. I know my other friends will disagree and it seems you also disagree.

For this, I dont think you roll it into any other invoices. Simply continue like normal. The problem may arise when you have a difference of opinion. It sounds like she is not thrilled about paying, and if you are serious about receiving your pay, would you be ok losing that customer if it comes to that?

Are you intending on billing her the 1 hour or a pro-rated rate?

vangogh
03-02-2009, 11:45 AM
Hard call. Personally I'd be pretty mad at the client It's one thing to say you should do the work for free before you do the work and another to say you think it should be free after the work is done. If this has been a good client maybe she gets some slack, but you're right in only delivering watermarked images from now on.

It's probably not worth fighting over the hour work. However if she won't pay now it calls into question whether she'll pay again in the future. The watermarks are one good way to protect yourself. On the larger projects I think I would insist on a deposit and full payment before deliver of the files.

You may also want to explain to her that a small project is still a project. It's not the continuation of previous work and you deserve to be paid for your time. Based on your description I get the feeling she won't be listening, but it's something you might try to get across to her.

I'm guessing at the moment you need to hang on to this client, but I'd probably be thinking about how to replace this client with one that respects your business.

huggytree
03-02-2009, 12:11 PM
i wouldnt charge her and would roll 1/2 hour into the next job..not 1 hour...

next time you do a small project for her you need to tell her the charges ahead of time and get an ok...is it possible it was a misunderstanding? that she thought it was free all along?.....

can you afford to lose the customer?....is it worth losing someone over $50?

i always try to turn a neg into a positive..there's a way with this problem...do it right and you hold her...do it wrong and you lose her...

i call her back and say ' im sorry about the misunderstanding about the charge for that small job. your a good steady customer that i enjoy working for and ill take care of it at no charge'

ive eaten costs many times on misunderstandings which didnt seem like a misunderstanding. i broke even on a couple of them, but held the customer and made profit on all the next projects for them...you may just have to adjust how you handle her in the future...i add extra disclaimers to some of my customers to cover myself from abuse.....everyone does business different and sees things differently.....and some are outright conmen...she may try to push you further next time...make sure this doesnt happen again by doing it different next time...giving her an estimate before hand would solve the problem.

Spider
03-02-2009, 12:12 PM
My view is to let it go. Pretend it didn't happen - no invoice, no rolling it into the next invoice. Just forget it. It's not a big enough loss of money to lose a customer over.

I think we, as business people, hurt ourselves by finding it difficult to give things away. When I am helping my wife in her business - pet grooming - I am always encouraging her to give away little things - like not charging to clip a dog's claws whether part of the groom or a separate walk-in. And tell the people you didn't charge for it. When I deal with one of her customers, for boarding, say, I invariably knock half a day off the bill. In my own coaching business, I occasionally take on a free client, or give free speeches on a self-improvement topic - and when I buy a personal development book, I usually buy two or three and give those away.

Sure, you can argue that these little sums mount up over the course of a year, but how much do you spend on advertising over a year? And how many customers do you get for your advertising dollar? IOW - how much does it cost you to acquire each new customer? Spend $5,000 advertising and get 20 new customers as a result, those customers cost you $250 each. Giving away a few dollars here and there to keep an existing customer is way better value that advertising for new ones.

Besides, I have found that customers love it when you give them unexpected stuff or discounts for no reason. That's how you develop raving fans, and having raving fans is how you grow your business.

KristineS
03-02-2009, 12:37 PM
I'd just let it go. It sounds like she's one of your biggest customers right now and she pays pretty regularly. Taking a stand might get you paid, but it probably will place future, more lucrative projects in jeopardy.

If it really bothers you, start looking for other clients that can replace the revenue, and then cut this lady loose when you've found them.

huggytree
03-02-2009, 01:18 PM
dont let the freebee's get out of hand...i have 1 customer who lives in my town...im up to 5 trips to his house....only 1 was partially charged for...i usually give free or at cost to work my my contractors own homes.... until he gives me a major job im done with him...

so make sure the free bee your giving doesnt keep happening...

Blessed
03-02-2009, 01:21 PM
I think I'm going to kinda drop it and not mention it again but make sure that I'm fully compensated on the next job or two I do for her. She usually has 500 nit-picking edits to each job and usually only gets charged for about 450 of them - not anymore.

She is already 2nd on my list of "customers to get rid of ASAP". For one reason is the 500 nit-picking edits that she never wants to pay for, for another...If she gets high-res PDF's to her printer before I get my check she always argues with me about the bill and tries to get me to lower it. I never do.

This lady is definitely a pain in the rear, but the business is going to go away soon, even if I keep doing work for her. She sells direct mail marketing to trade schools and is already down to one group of schools from the five or six groups she had when I started working for her a few years ago. She refuses to get up to speed and offer recipients of the mailer (who are usually 17 to 25 years old) a way to respond via text message or email and sticks with phone and mail-in response. The buyer at the one group of schools she has left is of the same mind-frame. This lady is also in her late 50's, found a wealthy boyfriend a couple of years ago that she spends most of her time with and has been selling off her investment properties and etc... that she had around here. I have a feeling that she'll close up shop when the last group of schools moves on to someone else.

If she sent referrals my way, didn't usually argue with me about bills and hadn't tried at least one other time to slip a job by me this way (I caught that one within a couple of weeks - this one I let go for a month before I called her back about it), and had not complained long and loud last summer about having to pay for the marketing piece she had me design (we're talking about a 30 hour project) and then decided not print... I'd be much more inclined to let this one go.

Spider - I agree with you, we should be willing to give things away and I do... at least until you become a persistent pain in my backside. My rates are more than fair and if I've done a job that takes lots and lots and lots of hours I've been known to discount my hourly rate. But when I feel like someone is trying to take advantage of me I have to draw a line and stand firmly behind it. That's how I'm feeling right now. She's a middle-man and she got paid for the job - including the edits, so why shouldn't I?

OK, I'm done ranting and raving... off to finish some other work now :D

cocoy
03-02-2009, 01:46 PM
I always charge for any additional changes when a job is finished. I let the client know this in their contract.

If you intend to do the same then you should let them know upfront. Some think that since they already paid for the job that any other changes afterwards are free.

Blessed
03-02-2009, 02:38 PM
I always charge for any additional changes when a job is finished. I let the client know this in their contract.

If you intend to do the same then you should let them know upfront. Some think that since they already paid for the job that any other changes afterwards are free.

I do this too. And this form was finished in the fall of 2007 so the changes were definitely a new "job" this customer knows this - she's just trying to get something for nothing.

My life was crazy enough in January that she pretty much got away with it. It's my fault for not following up sooner, but when I called Friday and said "I was just wondering if everything was ok with... or if there were any additional changes, etc..." and she replied with the answer she gave me - it irritated me.

Dan Furman
03-02-2009, 03:09 PM
My view is to let it go. Pretend it didn't happen - no invoice, no rolling it into the next invoice. Just forget it. It's not a big enough loss of money to lose a customer over.


My thoughts exactly (the entire post)

One thing you may want to do from now on is establish up front "this'll be about a half hour" etc (I'd also adopt a half hour rate for this type of thing).