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View Full Version : Now they're calling it "Audience Amplification". It's still garbage to me.



Harold Mansfield
02-21-2013, 12:08 PM
Has anyone noticed the recent rash of new companies promising to make your company the hip cool one on Facebook, promising to increase your user engagement?

I checked one or two of them out, and all the are doing is creating a bunch of low brow content that only serves to get likes and shares, and not doing any actual marketing or branding.

I fail to see how posting content with the sole purpose of getting likes, and has nothing to do with your company, does anything to increase awareness of your product, or sales helps you do anything except build arbitrary numbers that aren't convertable into sales. If people are only following you for the cute kitty pictures, how is that helping?

Am I the only one that sees these new "services" as trendy bandwagon jumpers? Or is there anything usable and of substance to be gained by basically what is old school chain letters and link baiting?

nealrm
02-21-2013, 12:39 PM
I'm sure that there is something that is usable and of substance that gets put into the pockets of those selling the service. But I doubt that the rest of us will get much out of it.

Harold Mansfield
02-21-2013, 01:01 PM
The only thing that I can MAYBE see is some kind of measure of the kinds of things that people respond to, to incorporate into your Social Media plan, But we already know what that is....puppies, cats, jokes and anything political.

I think in this space ( and I hate using that word), too many are focused on numbers and not the quality of your followers.

Side Note: Anytime anyone says things to me like "Properly leverage your position in the space", I'm out.

IADS
02-21-2013, 08:10 PM
I believe it to be similar to having a mailing list with random names on. A list with targeted names is obviously much better. I wouldn't call it useless, but it does matter the cost vs conversion rate. If it were free and I only got one sale, no harm.

Also, the company may get them in the door, but it is your job to make the sale.

vangogh
02-22-2013, 10:57 AM
I fail to see how posting content with the sole purpose of getting likes, and has nothing to do with your company, does anything to increase awareness of your product, or sales helps you do anything except build arbitrary numbers that aren't convertable into sales. If people are only following you for the cute kitty pictures, how is that helping?

It's no different that the companies who charge you to spam forums and blogs with pointless comments for useless links or the companies that charge you to write garbage articles and then submit them to social sites no one has every heard of or …

It goes on and on. There will always be people charging other people for useless things that they make sound useful.

KristineS
02-22-2013, 03:35 PM
I've seen some of this too Harold, and I'm tired of it already. Random likes of a photo or comment on your page mean nothing. Let's face it, there are certain things you can post pictures of, puppies, kittens, babies etc, that will always get likes. Engagement is not clicking the like button. Engagement is interacting with the company by leaving comments, reviews, etc.

Definitely agree that people get caught up in the numbers game and don't really pay attention to the fact that the numbers may be high but they don't really mean anything. You want people to engage with you and like what your brand and your company are about, not some random photo of a kitten or a sunrise.

vangogh
02-27-2013, 10:40 PM
People lose track of the end game. There are all these points along the way that make sense to track, but only with the sense that they lead to the end and aren't the end itself. The problem is people start associating those mid points with the end and assume reaching the mid point is the same as reaching the finish line. Then they chase those mid points and lose track of what's really important.

One thing I would add about the people selling things like more Facebook likes is they only exist because people are not only willing, but desiring to buy what they're pedaling.

patrickprecisione
03-29-2013, 03:18 PM
Unfortunately there's a number of digital snake oil salesmen out there. They promise lots of Likes, repins, followers etc. but the minute you mention ROI to them they're oddly silent. It's a shame because they prey on those who don't know any better. With that being said, there are good ones out there too! Like with any industry you're going to have this sort of thing. As long as you do your homework, understand what you're looking for and as vangogh says not "lose track of what's really important" you can find a good social media agency.

KristineS
03-29-2013, 04:22 PM
It's true, there are people out there who are doing good things in the social media arena, but it is a case of buyer beware. It pays for any business owner to be at least somewhat conversant with how social media works before they hire anyone. Unless you understand what social media can do, you don't know what it could do for you.

vangogh
04-01-2013, 11:40 PM
Like with any industry you're going to have this sort of thing.

True. It's hardly limited to social media. People in all industries push things across a certain line and they get away with it more when the people they're selling to don't take the time to learn anything about what's being sold to them. Things like social media and seo come across like magic to those who don't take the time to learn about them so it's easy to sell them magic and snake oil.

patrickprecisione
04-03-2013, 01:27 PM
Things like social media and seo come across like magic to those who don't take the time to learn about them so it's easy to sell them magic and snake oil.

You especially have to be selective when selecting an SEO company. Unbeknownst to you they could be using some black hat tactics that could seriously hurt your site. Then you're stuck paying to fix their mistakes.

vangogh
04-08-2013, 12:31 AM
True. I think the same could be said when hiring most anyone though. Unfortunately there are people in all industries who'll sooner rip you off than help you. The best way to avoid that is to learn something about the industry you plan on hiring from. I realize people aren't going to gain advanced knowledge in seo in a couple of weeks, but you can spend a few nights over a week or two in order to learn enough to hire someone.

billbenson
04-08-2013, 03:13 PM
In hiring an outside seo firm, I would want to see a list of customers who's sites have been in the top 5 on google for a year or more. If I was hiring a marketing manager, I would like to see on his resume at least a hobby site that has placed well on G for a year or more.

vangogh
04-11-2013, 12:17 AM
The thing is there's a lot more to seo than placing a site in the top 5 on Google. I can get any page to #1 in Google if you let me choose the phrase it ranks for. Ranking isn't the be all and end all of seo. That's seo 10 years ago. Today a good seo firm looks at things more holistically. The phrase search engine optimization isn't really the best phrase to describe what they do, but it's one the industry is likely stuck with.

I agree with you that when hiring any company you'd like to see some proof they can do the job. But keep in mind that once those companies show you the proof, you better be prepared so spend what they charge. In my experience, the small businesses I've come across aren't willing to spend on seo what they seem to expect back from it. It's like insisting your next hire has 20 years experience and then offering minimum wage as salary.

billbenson
04-11-2013, 01:34 AM
The thing is there's a lot more to seo than placing a site in the top 5 on Google. I can get any page to #1 in Google if you let me choose the phrase it ranks for. Ranking isn't the be all and end all of seo. That's seo 10 years ago. Today a good seo firm looks at things more holistically. The phrase search engine optimization isn't really the best phrase to describe what they do, but it's one the industry is likely stuck with.

I agree with you that when hiring any company you'd like to see some proof they can do the job. But keep in mind that once those companies show you the proof, you better be prepared so spend what they charge. In my experience, the small businesses I've come across aren't willing to spend on seo what they seem to expect back from it. It's like insisting your next hire has 20 years experience and then offering minimum wage as salary.

That's one of the reasons I put a one year plus on site rankings. Maybe that should be more like 5 years. But either in hiring a designer / developer or an employee that will manage a web department, I want some proof that they know what they are doing. Most web designers put up elegant sites and say "hey I did this" And the commentaries from the customers are "hey, they were great to work with and my site is beautiful". They may be out there but I don't recall anyone saying on a site review "they tripled my web income over the past two years".

Maybe the question I would ask either a prospect employee or designer is how has the web changed and what do you need to do for to place well on G 5 years ago and now. Or more correctly make money on a website 5 years ago vs today. If he / she doesn't know what recip links are / were they haven't been in the business long. If they tell me that is a good way of marketing today I'd run like crazy.

KristineS
04-11-2013, 01:09 PM
Maybe the question I would ask either a prospect employee or designer is how has the web changed and what do you need to do for to place well on G 5 years ago and now. Or more correctly make money on a website 5 years ago vs today. If he / she doesn't know what recip links are / were they haven't been in the business long. If they tell me that is a good way of marketing today I'd run like crazy.

I'd say those sorts of questions are a good way to tell if someone knows their stuff or not. It's always a good idea to have a list of questions you should ask web designers or marketing professionals or social media "experts". Anyone can claim they are one of those things, but not everyone can back that up.

Harold Mansfield
04-11-2013, 01:18 PM
I think part of the problem is that people assume that a web designer does everything online including marketing and SEO. Many do not. They just design..which is what they say they do.

I also think that people have unrealistic expectations of their website (And everything else online), and expect it to be a miracle of coding that intuitively does all of your marketing for you. As if just being online is all it takes..now the money should start rolling in.

Time and time again I see people that have a nice website that they haven't touched since it was built, yet blame it for not getting any traffic, or for not "bringing them more business".

Every year it gets harder and harder to explain to people that the website is just a bunch of files and folders that make up what is basically an interactive, online document. It doesn't do anything on it's own as if there is a team of little elves in there that go out around the web and lead people back to your company, and that they aren't the only person in the world trying to rank.

And yet, they are still of the belief that there is some secret special way that you are supposed to know how to code it that is supposed to create a traffic explosion for them.

vangogh
04-17-2013, 01:20 AM
people assume that a web designer does everything online including marketing and SEO

Yep. And worse they somehow think it's all included on one low, low price. I can do more than just design a site, but it doesn't mean I'm going to if you're not planning on paying for all the work. When I build a website I build it so it can be a good foundation for what you do after in terms of marketing and seo. That's not the same thing as me doing all your marketing and seo for the next year.


Time and time again I see people that have a nice website that they haven't touched since it was built, yet blame it for not getting any traffic, or for not "bringing them more business".

Yep. It's like having a storefront, but never sweeping up outside or giving the place a coat of paint after a few years. Even more it's like you have the storefront and they build a shopping center all around you, with lots of new stores. Maybe even one that competes with you. The new shopping center includes this big parking lot that can accommodate lots of customers, but since you weren't willing to contribute none of the spots can be used for your store and a wall is put up block your store from the rest of the shopping center.